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Lion Air Crash in Bali

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  • Originally posted by redsnapr View Post
    Could one of the forum member pilots confirm whether Ngurah Rai has an ILS approach procedure? If there is one, is Lion Air qualified to operate ILS landings?

    The crew obviously did not abort the landing approach at the published MDA of 465 ft of altitude and continued descending even though neither crew had the runway in sight. The PIC took over command of the airplane at 150 ft. AGL and called for a go around at 20 ft AGL. Way too late.
    The answer to the ILS procedure is apparently yes and no. There is an ILS approach procedure but it's on runway 27 and not on runway 09 which was where the Lion Air flight was attempting to land. 09 has a VOR DME approach.
    "[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Helvetica Neue]I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.[/FONT][/COLOR]"
    George Bernard Shaw

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    • thank God everybody is alive. i usually fly lion to singapore, it's quite on time and cheap compared to airasia

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      • Originally posted by lantern View Post
        The answer to the ILS procedure is apparently yes and no. There is an ILS approach procedure but it's on runway 27 and not on runway 09 which was where the Lion Air flight was attempting to land. 09 has a VOR DME approach.
        Curious that the tower would direct the Lion aircraft to a VOR approach when the visibility was bad and an ILS approach was available. Was the wind a factor in deciding on 09 versus 27?

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        • Originally posted by waarmstrong View Post
          Curious that the tower would direct the Lion aircraft to a VOR approach when the visibility was bad and an ILS approach was available. Was the wind a factor in deciding on 09 versus 27?
          The wind was 120 degrees at 5 knots and so 27 was out of the question.

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          • Originally posted by waarmstrong View Post
            Curious that the tower would direct the Lion aircraft to a VOR approach when the visibility was bad and an ILS approach was available. Was the wind a factor in deciding on 09 versus 27?
            Originally posted by wombat View Post
            The wind was 120 degrees at 5 knots and so 27 was out of the question.
            [SIZE=2]
            As far as I understand runways are designed in accordance with local winds and the winds that day were favoring runway 09 because as mentioned by wombat 't[/SIZE][COLOR=#333333]he wind was 120 degrees at 5 knots' which meant a slight headwind coming from the right.
            [/COLOR][SIZE=2]Runway 27 is facing 270 degrees magnetically and runway 09 is facing 90 degrees.

            [/SIZE]
            "[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Helvetica Neue]I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.[/FONT][/COLOR]"
            George Bernard Shaw

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            • So which airline is considered the safest in Indo for domestic purposes ?

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              • Originally posted by lantern View Post
                [SIZE=2]
                As far as I understand runways are designed in accordance with local winds and the winds that day were favoring runway 09 because as mentioned by wombat 't[/SIZE][COLOR=#333333]he wind was 120 degrees at 5 knots' which meant a slight headwind coming from the right.
                [/COLOR][SIZE=2]Runway 27 is facing 270 degrees magnetically and runway 09 is facing 90 degrees. [/SIZE]
                Thanks guys. I am familiar with runway designations, but was a bit lazy in not looking up the wind speed and direction for the fateful day.

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                • Originally posted by samsiam View Post
                  So which airline is considered the safest in Indo for domestic purposes ?
                  Garuda is always considered the safest. However as Lion air is now using mostly new planes, for the next few months I am sure they are safe. What happened in Bali comes under the "shit happens" class
                  [COLOR=#ff0000]Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds[/COLOR]. Albert Einstein

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                  • Originally posted by jim69 View Post
                    Garuda is always considered the safest. However as Lion air is now using mostly new planes, for the next few months I am sure they are safe. What happened in Bali comes under the "shit happens" class
                    Not ALWAYS....possibly you mean NOW.

                    I remember a few stupid incidents in Australia with them that could have ended very badly.

                    But new planes or not, I presume the pilots have a little to do with it !!!

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                    • Originally posted by samsiam View Post
                      not always....possibly you mean now.

                      I remember a few stupid incidents in australia with them that could have ended very badly.

                      But new planes or not, i presume the pilots have a little to do with it !!!
                      whatever!!!!
                      [COLOR=#ff0000]Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds[/COLOR]. Albert Einstein

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                      • Originally posted by jim69 View Post
                        whatever!!!!
                        Go Jim.

                        Like...did you flick your hair back when you wrote that ??

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                        • Originally posted by waarmstrong View Post
                          [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman]Thanks guys. I am familiar with runway designations, but was a bit lazy in not looking up the wind speed and direction for the fateful day.[/FONT][/SIZE]
                          [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman]

                          One theory that seems to be doing the rounds is that they thought they [COLOR=#333333]were following a perfect landing approach, despite lack of visibility, but came out of the clouds and saw that they were short of the runway, hit the TOGA button (take off go around) which gives full power and then pitched up steeply causing the tail of the plane to have first contact with the water which could explain the fractured tail and also possibly the lack of injuries as direct contact at speed was avoided. [/COLOR] [/FONT][/SIZE]
                          Last edited by lantern; 17-05-13, 15:36. Reason: spelling
                          "[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Helvetica Neue]I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.[/FONT][/COLOR]"
                          George Bernard Shaw

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by samsiam View Post
                            So which airline is considered the safest in Indo for domestic purposes ?
                            You asked a question here and someone answered it.

                            Originally posted by samsiam View Post
                            Not ALWAYS....possibly you mean NOW.

                            I remember a few stupid incidents in Australia with them that could have ended very badly.

                            But new planes or not, I presume the pilots have a little to do with it !!!
                            Then you argue the answer. If you already have an opinion of the answer to your question, why ask? Why not go and read the thread? It was all already discussed. Go start a fight someplace else.
                            [COLOR=#333333][FONT=Verdana]Some love to milk Apostate.[/FONT][/COLOR]

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                            • Originally posted by fastpitch17 View Post
                              You asked a question here and someone answered it.


                              Then you argue the answer. If you already have an opinion of the answer to your question, why ask? Why not go and read the thread? It was all already discussed. Go start a fight someplace else.
                              Whatever!!!

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                              • Samsiam,
                                I think that you've been warned a couple of times by moderators about our policy, haven't you?
                                Inflammatory posts are not welcome in this forum. We first warn posters, but if they persist in ignoring warnings, we shift gears. Rather than deleting posts, we can delete membership.

                                Posting Guidelines.

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