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Dating Hijabers (Women who wear head scarfs.)

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  • #61
    [SIZE=7]funny....
    [SIZE=2]

    i just found this thread is funny...


    [/SIZE]
    [/SIZE]

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    • #62
      I dont even understand why the OP made this thread.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by DanInAceh View Post

        Christianity, on the other hand, is a big fan of the dubious tales of "judge not lest ye be judged." At least modern Christianity, I should say, as that crap was added much later.

        Anyway, Muslims are free to be a little bit judgmental.
        I am a christian Dan, and I believe that what you call as 'crap'. It's very offensive I think to say it's crap. Christianity isn't your believe, but can't you respect it?

        So you think that yourself is a holy person with no sin so you are free to be a judgmental?
        a little or not judgmental is a judgmental.

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        • #64
          Originally posted by thediamond View Post
          I dont even understand why the OP made this thread.
          We don't need to understand why, D

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          • #65
            Is it wrong to have erotic fantasies about women wearing jilbabs?

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            • #66
              Originally posted by DanInAceh View Post
              In Islamic theology, Islam is the natural state of humanity. This is why some Muslim converts choose to call themselves "reverts." I disagree with using the term "revert," but it is true that it is the official stance of the religion. This means that it is not an excuse that you were "born into it and didn't like it."

              Obviously, Muslim parents have certain expectations concerning their offspring. We must try to teach Islamic values where we can. However, you must ultimately decide to accept Islam proper as a young adult. We don't quite have a concept like "confirmation" in Catholicism, but it is spelled out that each human must make a decision to be a Muslim.
              Your second para contradicts your first.

              You can decide as a young adult. But if you reject islam as a young adult it is not a valid reason that you were born into it and had no choice? So what is someone in that position meant to do?

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              • #67
                Originally posted by Berlarutlarut View Post
                But if you reject islam as a young adult it is not a valid reason that you were born into it and had no choice? So what is someone in that position meant to do?
                Fake it like the "fake converts". In the real world appearances trump substance. Why do you think I have to drink my beer from a nontransparent mug in the pubs in Kemang during Ramadan?
                "[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Helvetica Neue]I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.[/FONT][/COLOR]"
                George Bernard Shaw

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                • #68
                  Originally posted by Berlarutlarut View Post
                  Your second para contradicts your first.

                  You can decide as a young adult. But if you reject islam as a young adult it is not a valid reason that you were born into it and had no choice? So what is someone in that position meant to do?
                  Had no choice, eh? Ultimately believing or not is solely up to the individual. You cannot coerce someone into believing. You may certainly create a person who makes the outward appearance of someone who believes.

                  Many Westerners feel that religion is "forced" on them. Religion as an ideology is no more so forced upon you than your politics or government. It is certainly something that is learned, something you are influenced on. Even if you are "born into it," you still have the choice.

                  If humans had been meant to have no choice in the matter they would have been made perfect servitors as the angels were.

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                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Berlarutlarut View Post
                    Is it wrong to have erotic fantasies about women wearing jilbabs?
                    Not at all. Desiring women, if you are a man, is completely healthy in Islam. There is nothing to say that being attracted to a woman's clothing is "wrong."

                    Your sexual health is important. Numerous ahadith attest to the importance of regular sexual intercourse, and also that married partners (note that I did not say "couples") should engage in acts that excite and pleasure the other. Foreplay is considered a necessity, and a woman can even seek divorce on the grounds that a man did not give her sufficient sexual pleasure.

                    We are not prudes, contrary to the popular misconception of the kuffar. Never have been, never will be.

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                    • #70
                      Originally posted by DanInAceh View Post
                      Religion as an ideology is no more so forced upon you than your politics or government. It is certainly something that is learned, something you are influenced on. Even if you are "born into it," you still have the choice.
                      Does this really represent the reality? Can the daughter of a conservative Muslim family really decide to reject Islam with the same ease that she would decide to vote for a different political party?

                      You stated earlier that "[COLOR=#333333]You cannot get a "divorce" from Islam, there is no clean break" and that "[/COLOR]there's no 'confirmation' in Islam. In that case when does the young person decide? When is the point of no return or no chance of "buyers remorse" as mentioned earlier?

                      I don't know the statistics for the number of women in 'Islamic countries' who reject Islam in their teens but I would imagine it would read like a North Korean election result.
                      "[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Helvetica Neue]I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.[/FONT][/COLOR]"
                      George Bernard Shaw

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                      • #71
                        Originally posted by lantern View Post
                        Does this really represent the reality? Can the daughter of a conservative Muslim family really decide to reject Islam with the same ease that she would decide to vote for a different political party?

                        You stated earlier that "[COLOR=#333333]You cannot get a "divorce" from Islam, there is no clean break" and that "[/COLOR]there's no 'confirmation' in Islam. In that case when does the young person decide? When is the point of no return or no chance of "buyers remorse" as mentioned earlier?

                        I don't know the statistics for the number of women in 'Islamic countries' who reject Islam in their teens but I would imagine it would read like a North Korean election result.
                        They decide when they are mature enough to decide. This isn't really a fixed age, it is whenever that person is responsible enough to truly understand and accept Islam. That is why we say that converts have "accepted" Islam and why da'wah literally means "invitation." We invite people to live in the fold of Islam.

                        I did chuckle at the last line, though. It is amusing because the perspective Westerners have about religion is that it is coercive, that it is forced upon them. Religion is nowhere near as coercive as governments, entities from which there is no escape.

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                        • #72
                          Originally posted by DanInAceh View Post
                          There are certainly still those who believe "it's not in the Qur'an" (for the record, those people are wrong), but they are being drowned out by more conservative voices at the present time. Now more than in the past 100 years, Muslim women are covering. It will be interesting to see if this trend goes away in our lifetime.
                          Nimbus is correct. It is an identity symbol. Probe "why do you wear it?" and see what kind of answers you get in the survey. Proliferation is fashion, at least a much as exoteric religosity.

                          As for the Quran, I have read authoritative Muslim commentary which emphasizes that the Quran says "dress modestly" or "dim your attractiveness". I don't recall anyone claiming that a specific style of clothing (worn by Roman noblewomen, among others in pre-Islamic history) is indicated by text.

                          Also, even if jilbab is in the Quran, I'm quite sure it is indicated only for "child-bearing" age. Putting it on a toddler age 3 (who pretty much has little choice in the matter) seems bizarre -- is this a statement that the child is sexually mature enough to be married? If more is better, why didn't the Quran tell people to pray 50 times a day instead of 5?

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                          • #73
                            Originally posted by DanInAceh View Post
                            There's no "buyer's remorse" policy in Islam. Taking the shahada is a serious matter, one that should come with research and honest intention.

                            It is not choosing a home or a car, it's not changing your politics. To Muslims, that is the most serious commitment you will ever make. You cannot get a "divorce" from Islam, there is no clean break.

                            That person would be an apostate.

                            I suppose though if you took the shahada without believing a word of it and got your "Islam" convert certificate from a corrupt KUA official, who took an envelope of money to do the conversion, knowing that you were doing it only for the marriage certificate, than you wouldn't be an apostate as you technically never truthfully entered Islam.

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                            • #74
                              I thought Islam doesn't allow dating.
                              [FONT=tahoma]be strong.. I whispered to my wi-fi signal[/FONT]

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                              • #75
                                About women and covering their adornments:
                                http://corpus.quran.com/translation....er=24&verse=31

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