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  • marcus
    replied
    Originally posted by Darkknightdel View Post
    (1) I asked about my situation and the law of 2013.

    (2) However, a very nice officer at immigration said that they now follow a 2014 immigration law which stipulates that in case of divorce, your kitap is indeed cancelled...

    (1) It is a Government Regulation (Peraturan Pemerintah no.31 Tahun 2013) , not a Law .

    (2) Please check with the officer , the identification of this "2014 immigration law" .
    As far as I know , there is no newer Immigration Law than the UU no.6 Tahun 2011 (except the 2020's Omnibus Law which , as far as I know , only changed Visa/Sponsor for investors) .

    From my personal file (but I am not a lawyer):

    - There is a Minister Regulation (Peraturan Menteri no.27 Tahun 2014) which , yes , in its Article 70 it repeats what UU no.6 , 2011 states (only marriages over 10 years could maintain the KITAP) , but it does no cancel Article 163 of Peraturan Pemerintah no.31 Tahun 2013 which added marriages of less than 10 years too .

    - There is also the Peraturan Pemerintah no.26 Tahun 2016 issued specifically to revise the Peraturan no.31 Tahun 2013 , but it didn't cancel/change the Article 163 of the former Peraturan (which added the marriages of less than 10 years for keeping the KITAP) .

    Poster's Note : What , in my view , is questionable , is that maybe PP no.31 Tahun 2013 could not include this Article 163 (see below) as it exceeds the intent of a Law (UU no.6 Tahun 2011) , in other words , a Regulation could not change a Law (as far as I know) , although I am personally in favor of this Article 163 , or something similar that at least would maintain the KITAP for marriages with a child or children .


    -----------------------------------------------


    PP no.31 Year 2013 - Government Regulation to implement UU no.6 Tahun 2011 (not an official translation)
    Article 163
    (1) For mixed marriage that lasted less than 10 (ten) years, the KITAP will remain valid although his/her marriage has ended due to divorce and/or upon court decision , if the foreigner concerned has a sponsor.
    (2) The sponsor as contemplated in clause (1) must be an Indonesian .
    (3) The sponsor as contemplated in clause (2) must be submitted to Immigration Office within the maximum period of 60 (sixty) days as of date of divorce deed is issued.


    -----------------------------------------------


    UU no.6 Tahun 2011 - Immigration Law (not an official translation)
    Article 62
    ....
    (2) A KITAP is revoked when its holder :
    a. has committed a crime against the state as stipulated in laws and regulations;
    b. carried out activities which endanger state security;
    c. violetad the Integration Statement;
    d. employed foreign workers without work permits;
    e. provided false information in the filing of the KITAP's petition;
    f. was penalized by Immigration Administrative Measures, or

    g. did break up a marriage with an Indonesian , except if the marriage had aged 10 (ten) years or more.

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  • Darkknightdel
    replied
    I have been married for 5 years and 2 months. 

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  • jakartaharpman
    replied
    I am not aware of any 2014 law. Which law is the officer referring to? As far as I am aware, the prevailing law is still UU No.6/2011. Check out Article 62 Item 2 Point G. But I forgot to ask how long you were married for. I was assuming you were married for more than 10 years? If you were married for less than 10 years, the immigration officer is correct: your ITAP is cancelled. If you were married for longer than 10 years, the immigration officer is wrong.

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  • Darkknightdel
    replied
    Originally posted by jakartaharpman View Post
    I just scrolled up to the beginning of this thread. I see that I posted more details there.
    When did you do your change of sponsor? And was it in jakarta? I went to surabaya.

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  • Darkknightdel
    replied
    Hi everyone, i have just been to immigration and back. I asked about my situation and the law of 2013. However, a very nice officer at immigration said that they now follow a 2014 immigration law which stipulates that in case of divorce, your kitap is indeed cancelled. There is no chance of submitting a new spomsor. This has made me rather down as it seems my options are not that viable. What can i do now?

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  • jakartaharpman
    replied
    I just scrolled up to the beginning of this thread. I see that I posted more details there.

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  • jakartaharpman
    replied
    In my case it was a bit of silly paperwork. Even though my "new" sponsor was the same person as my old sponsor, her status was actually different. A spouse is a "Penamggung Jawab", whereas an ex-spouse is a "Penjamin". So had to process a document stating this. Didn't cost anything, though.

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  • Darkknightdel
    replied
    Also, what was your total cost to change sponsor? Did they ask that the new sponsor show a fat bank account?

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  • Darkknightdel
    replied
    Hi jakartaharpman thank you for your message. What sort of documents were needed to change sponsor?

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  • jakartaharpman
    replied
    You can continue with your existing kitap. Your ex-wife or your current girlfriend can be your sponsor. In my case, my ex-wife is my sponsor. That is the best solution, I think, if you have children together. There is an extra step to go through if you want your ex-wife to remain as your sponsor.

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  • Darkknightdel
    replied
    This is a very detailed story thanks so much. I live in sidoarjo and am about to go to immigration tomorrow to ask about chabging sponsorship. I will be getting divorced soon which is inevitable and i assume the info i get can be totally different since it seems each immi office has their own interpretation. My soon to be ex-wife or a friend of mine will definitely be my sponsor, but they do bot have huge bank accounts to show. I am separated currently and i have a relationship with an indonesian lady who would marry me. I wonder if i divorce and my (hypothetical) new wife is my new sponsor, would i just be able to continue my existing kitap. Any help, tips would be much appreciated.

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  • jakartaharpman
    replied
    I just read this - great post and story. Loved it. Glad it all worked out for you, bar the excessive payments - which, as you say (and Immigration understand all too well) are a "small price" to pay for the chance to live here forever. Having to go through the Tangerang office will have been one of the main stumbling blocks here. You were the guinea pig for them, just as I was for the Jakarta Selatan office.

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  • all4ywh
    replied
    On march 8th I learned that my change of sponsor request for my ITAP was approved!


    However as I previously wrote in my previous posts above : due to divorce because my “unlimited/lifetime” ITAP already was canceled but my request to change sponsor was approved, at this time I must still pay a new 5-year ITAP fee of IDR 3,7 million and a new 2-year MERP (exit-entry permit) fee of IDR 1,8 million. I was told that in 5 years if my friend still is the same sponsor, then at that time my ITAP renewal will be for the “unlimited/lifetime” ITAP. Ironically the same "negative tone" officer at the DirJen office in Jakarta who I met on february 22nd was the same officer who yesterday informed me that my request was approved, but he would not inform me about which specific immigration regulation states that based on my situation I must pay again the full fees for a ITAP & 2-year MERP. However, after receiving the approval to continue with permanent resident status in Indonesia and at this time not desiring to agitate his superiors at the DirJen office, I decided to hold my tongue and not protest about the required new payment of fees. If it turns out that for only the past 14 months I paid the amount of IDR 12 million for my previous short-term “unlimited/lifetime” ITAP : I equate that payment as affording me the opportunity for all those months to be nearby by two young children – time enjoyed & cherished which is priceless...

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  • all4ywh
    replied
    During that visit I had to fill in 3 identical “requestor” receipt slips with my personal data. At this time it is written on those slips :

    Berkas akan diperiksa dan diteliti oleh petugas. Jika telah memenuhi persyaratan Surat Keputusan (SK) akan diselesaikan paling lambat tanggal _____________.” (on my slips an official at the DirJen office wrote in the date 01-03-18 [march 1st] ).

    Translation of the above statement : “File will be reviewed and be researched by an official. If it has fulfilled requirement Decision Letter will be finished at the latest date _______________.”

    On the current receipt slips there was nothing written about how notification to requestor would be conducted, so I asked the official at the DirJen office who I met during that visit and he said that I would be notified by either : email, phone call or WhatsApp.

    My next post is the conclusion of this saga...

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  • all4ywh
    replied
    On february 22nd, I delivered 1 envelope with a recommendation letter & photocopies of my immigration documents to the Direktorat Izin Tinggal Keimigrasian at the National Immigration Office in South Jakarta. Upon arrival I met 2 security guards at the reception desk who took my 1 envelope and requested that I fill out a “file delivery receipt” to accompany the envelope which I had delivered; also I received a copy of that receipt. During my conversation with those 2 security guards, I showed them the new payment invoice which I received from the immigration office in city of Tangerang which stated that I must pay the an additional ITAP fee of IDR 3,7 million and the 2-year MERP (exit-entry permit) fee of IDR 1,8 million. I pointed out to those security guards : only 13 months ago I gave a total payment of IDR 12 million for my ITAP renewal fee (which granted me the “unlimited/lifetime” ITAP) & the 2-year MERP (exit-entry permit which is valid until december 2018), and that the immigration officers at the immigration office in Tangerang simply told me that the payment invoice was "automatically" issued by the immigration database, and if I had any questions : I should ask the officials at the National Immigration Office when I deliver my file to this office. So those 2 security guards at the National Immigration Office told me that they would present my file to the appropriate officials in the Direktorat Izin Tinggal Keimigrasian and see if an officer was available to meet with me. 15 minutes later an officer appeared at the waiting room to meet with me. To preface : I entered the conversation with a positive & respectful demeanor. The officer had quite a negative demeanor. The following is a summary of the 30-minute conversation which was conducted in 99% Indonesian language :

    Officer : “Just now I briefly reviewed your file & I was informed that you have a question about this latest payment invoice which you received from the immigration office in Tangerang?”

    Me : “Yes”

    We proceeded to review : the documents in my file which identify my ITAP renewal from 13 months ago; the current request to change guarantor/sponsor and related documents from immigration office in Tangerang; the divorce certificate; details about my daughter & son. Then the officer asked me these questions :

    > Why was there a divorce between my former wife & me? My truthful answer : “because my former wife does not want a husband/partner/companion, therefore she filed for divorce in may 2017, and as the officer or anyone can read in the divorce decree : my wife submitted 3 false statements (lies) against me in her original divorce petition in an attempt to expedite the divorce proceedings, which I contested & addressed those false statements during all the 9 court hearings.

    > Why in may 2009 did I move to Jakarta. My answer : “So that I could reside in the same city as my former wife before our marriage.”

    > How is my relationship with my daughter who is 8 years old & my son who is 6 years old : both who are citizens of Indonesia? My answer : “very close & loving. Even since the official divorce between my former wife & me : at least 3 or 4 nights every week they stay with me & we enjoy daytime hours together as well.”

    > Currently am I in a romantic relationship with another Indonesian citizen? My answer : “no”.

    > Do I rent or own the house where currently I reside? My answer : “Rent for already 24 months. Just 12 days ago I extended the contract another 12 months for that house.”

    > What is my employment status? My answer : “I oversee the business which my former wife & I established in december 2009.”

    > What is my annual income from that business? My answer : “Enough to support the needs of my children & me.”

    > In my life have I ever been convicted of any crimes? My answer : “never”.

    > What is my relationship with my new guarantor/sponsor? My answer : “A friend who along with his wife: 8 years & 8 months ago I met them through my former wife..

    Officer : “Because your marriage with your former wife officially ended as of october 31, 2017 : your “unlimited/lifetime” ITAP will be canceled but your current request to change sponsor for an ITAP will be considered by my department, however there is no guarantee that your request will be granted : my superiors will consider all the details of your situation. By march 1st you will learn of the decision. If the change of sponsor is granted to you, the fees in the payment invoice given to you by the immigration office in Tangerang must be paid march 10th.”

    Me : “Sir, I am confused. Based on Peraturan Pemerintah (“PP”) Republik Indonesia Nomor 31 Tahun 2013, Tentang Peraturan Pelaksaan Undang-Undang Nomor 6 Tahun 2011 Tentang Keimigrasian, Pasal 163 (I show the article/clause to him), how can my current ‘unlimited/lifetime’ ITAP be canceled? In that article it specifically states : ‘For a mixed marriage which has age less than 10 years, Permanent Residence Permit [‘ITAP’] of Foreign Person which is legal remains valid although their marriage has ended because of divorce and/or on decision of court if the concerned Foreign Person has a Guarantor [sponsor].’ “

    Officer : “There are ‘other’ Peraturan Pemerintah which address your situation.”

    Me : “Which specific Peraturan Pemerintah ?”

    Officer : “I will inform you later.”

    Me : “Concerning the fees in the payment invoice given to me by the immigration office in Tangerang which just now you stated must be paid : which specific immigration regulation states that based on my situation I must pay again the full fees for a ITAP & 2-year MERP, when only 13 months ago I gave a total payment of IDR 12 million for my ITAP renewal fee (which granted me the ‘unlimited/lifetime’ ITAP) & the 2-year MERP (exit-entry permit which is valid until december 2018) ?”

    Officer : “I will inform you later. My superiors will consider that detail. ”

    Me : “For the past 8 years & 9 months I have resided continuously in Indonesia. Both of my young children were born here & are citizens of Indonesia. At this time I cannot imagine not being allowed to continue as a resident in this nation because this is the place of residence for my children.”

    Officer : “All those details will be considered by my superiors. However, if it is not the will of Almighty God for you to continue as a permanent resident here, what can you do? You have to follow the other paths presented to you. You could return as a tourist, then marry another citizen of Indonesia, or you could seek sponsorship through other employment. Why not return to your nation of birth and work over there, then every few months visit Indonesia to see your children? In this life there are many challenges & obstacles for each of us as human beings but whatever is the will of Almighty God, we cannot go against. If I resided in your nation of birth, and my permanent resident status was canceled by immigration, I could not protest & complain but I would need to return to Indonesia, correct?

    Me : “I have no desire to be separated by thousands of kilometers from my children. Now during this conversation, you already have seen that I have not protested or complained to you : I am here to ask for clarifications on points to which I have not been given answers by officers at either the the immigration office in Tangerang or the Kantor Wilayah in Serang, Banten. Secondly, actually for 13 years I had a working relationship with the immigration department in my nation of birth, and to address your question : if an individual’s permanent resident status happened to be canceled in that nation, the individual would have the right to appeal the decision.”

    Officer : “Let me tell you a story about me : in the year 2009 I was an immigration officer in this same office, but I worked in the department which oversaw the immigration affairs at Soekarno Hatta airport in Tangerang. In that year I was accused falsely of a crime related to immigration matters of my friend who wanted to work in Abu Dhabi. I was imprisoned for around 3 months until I was acquitted by the Supreme Court of those false charges, and now over 8 years later I am still an officer in the National Immigration office : so I survived that challenge & obstacle, therefore I am a stronger person because of it. So again my point to you : whatever is the will of Almighty God, we cannot go against. Is there anything else we need to discuss now? Because I desire to take my break now.”

    Me : “We have discussed enough for now, thank you. I will wait to hear back from you again about those specific immigration regulations which you referred to during this conversation.”

    Officer : “Alright, goodbye.”


    We ended the conversation respectfully. After I met with that officer, my instincts at that moment were not to directly ask for a meeting with his superiors because I felt that he would do something to make a problem with my resident status in Indonesia. Based on his negative demeanor during our 30-minute conversation : he is the very common type of individual who wears a government uniform & "talks down" to people as if everyone else who does not wear a uniform like him are not as intelligent as he is.

    (Continued in next post)...

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