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Why are some Indonesians so weird when it comes to dogs

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  • #46
    im devastated.

    last tuesday our chocolate lab puppy passed away. she was very smart and so playful, and she's the only thing that my wife got as a friend since she's living here with me. and againts all odds of being indonesian (and muslim) i was in my moment of having a very good relationship with a dog, the puppy, i started to love her sincerely and trying to give everything for her to make her happy in the family and to make myself and of course, my wife happy.

    she was 4-months old, we got them from a well-respected breeder at tangerang when she was 6 weeks, she just like a gangster and very naughty for a girl lab. being an active lab, she sniffs and chew everything but we didnt believe that she just gone just like that. she ate well, she sleeps in the house, she plays often also with both of us. sometimes we even bring her walk outside with minimum contact with stray dogs in our complex. she's only on her 2nd vaccination and her 3rd vaccination due Feb 16th.

    last friday she vomitted continuously, we thought its only because she's swallowed a wet tissue. we took to gustavvet and got her treated the next day. they even X-ray 'ed her and confirmed that something was inside her but its trying to come out. They said itll be out sooner or later, bring her back if she still not well until monday. the next day she's still vomitting, and what worries me is that now has bloods in it. on the other had, her poo was showing some kind of "tissue-material" so i guess maybe soon she'll be fine. apparently not. we bring her to vet on sunday, and they confirmed its Leptospirosis bacteria. she needs to be hospitalized quickly. so she did. saw my puppy with a infusion, worries me.

    The next day the blood test came n vet called me that her liver and kidney is affected, so they confirmed that the only thing can attack those organs so quickly is the Lepto bacteria. they did what theyve been taught of, the protocol, inject antibiotics n anti-vomit meds. but shes not getting better for two days. On tuesday morning the vet called n give me updates, the puppy is struggling heavily the vet said. 50-50 chance now. Later when i was on my way home, the vet called me again said the puppy is in critical condition n losing her breath. I was panic n pick up my wife at home as soon as possible, get the car n go to the PDHB animal hospital in alam sutera. Just when I was driving on that kebun jeruk highway vet told me they lost her, and my wife has been in shock ever since. She never lost a dog before and she didnt believe that it happened so fast. This is my first time also having a dog not just as a pet but as a family member, I was just starting to make a real bond with our dog but she just gone too fast.

    RIP Ruby.





    You will be missed.

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    • #47
      Condolences on your loss.
      Sasa Bule is having a bayi!

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      • #48
        So sorry to read this sad story, badak. In a short time you've learned how much love and happiness a dog can bring, and how much sadness comes with the loss. Don't give up on keeping a dog, though. Take some time to recover from the loss and hurt and maybe you and your family will be ready to try again.
        [FONT=Comic Sans MS]Warden: "What we got here ... is failure to communicate."

        The Dude: "Oh yeah? Well that's just, like, your opinion, man."[/FONT]

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        • #49
          sorry to hear your sad story Badaktempur, she was a lovely pup.

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          • #50
            RIP Ruby, Boncel my dog who also left me when I was a kid will play along with you there at the dog palace.
            Words can inspire, thoughts can provoke, but only action can get you closer to your dreams.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by yardmaster View Post
              I tried to find a definitive reason or an actual verse in the Quran that supported this belief of not having a dog. I could not find it. Only once is a dog mentioned in the Quran (that I could find), it guarded the entrance of a cave where the faithful slept. I then searched through the Haddiths, different story there. One thing for sure is that around the time of Muhammad (PBUH) dogs were part of everyday life for hunting, herding, and as guard dogs. I base this statement on several hadiths concerned with dogs used in all these practices. They were undoubtable kept as pets also. Problem I have with the Haddiths is that one scholar says one thing , another says something similar but not the same, but another will contradict. I’m not gonna post all these hadiths, hmmm maybe I should. Nah I will sum it up using my common sense. I’m by no means a scholar.


              [FONT=Calibri]5. [/FONT]Angels can’t come in your house if a dog is present,, ok this is the one I think has caused all the uproar. I read several accounts of this event and about three differing or contradicting stories on this event. And all admittedly transmitted through hearsay. Personally I don’t believe it. Angels go where God tells them to go period end of story.
              I don’t like a dog to have the run of the house anyway, and it must be well trained. Nothing wrong with having an outside dog either.

              There are a couple more but I didn’t think so relevant.
              Now I’m sure someone is gonna challenge my conclusions, its ok, I won’t mind. I’ve convinced myself a dog is ok in Islam, now I gotta convince the wife haha. Then again her family might be a different story.
              There isn't much contradictory information on dogs in the ahadith; their saliva is najis and they cannot be kept as pets. You may, however, keep them for labor as you've noted. Concerning the ahadith, though, remember that the hadith for number 5 is sahih (authenticated), making it second only to the Qur'an in value. I do not believe that there is significant disagreement among the jurists on having a dog; it is likely considered makruh in all traditions of fiqh. Owning a dog as a pet also, according to al-Bukhari, slowly erodes your rewards.

              With that said, I sympathize with you in the ownership of a dog. I like dogs and I also do believe there is a place for dogs in (or more likely, outside) of a Muslim household. Further, I would be a hypocrite to tell you to follow that particular hadith verbatim because this is what it says...

              [FONT=Helvetica]I heard Allah's Apostle [/FONT][FONT=Helvetica, Arial][FONT=Helvetica, Arial][/FONT] [/FONT][FONT=Helvetica]saying; "[COLOR=#ff0000][/COLOR]Angels (of Mercy) do not enter a house wherein there is a dog or[COLOR=#ff0000] a picture of a living creature.[/COLOR]"
              [/FONT]
              Like most modern humans and also most Muslims, I keep pictures in my home. And there is more evidence that pictures and art in general are bad news. Muhammad, sallahu aleyhi wa sellam, told an artist to paint inanimate objects if he absolutely must paint. Again, I think if you analyzed the opinions of the jurists you would find that the consensus is that having pictures around is makruh. Islam is a religion of preference in lesser matters, such as these. We cannot disregard or discount the ahadith concerning this issue, but we must also use our aql (reason) to deduce what is the response of the submitter to keeping pictures or dogs.

              Are you going to keep a dog as a novelty or abuse the animal? If so, that is prohibited. Are you instead going to make the dog useful and compliment its life? If so, that is permissible. May Allah (subhana wa ta'ala) guide you in this matter; my advice is tainted in some fashion or another.

              Ask your wife how she feels about pictures and then see what she says. I would be QUITE surprised to learn that she has an objection to images, and I think she may understand your point a bit better.

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              • #52
                Rip Ruby, I know the feeling of losing a dog as a family member. My 2 yo shitzu also has passed away few years ago and it was horrible. He died on my arms. He had some stages of seizures before he died. Shocking moment the first time in my life. Cried for months couldn't forget the the expression of my baby when struggling in his pain. But I had done everything I could to save him involving good doctors and animal hospital. I don't think I will ever forget that moment. but what worries me now is my 13 yo baby girl, she is very active and happy in her senior age and I realize considering her age... well I just hope God will give us more chances to be together as long as possible. She is the best in my life. GOD'S best gift for me. Losing her will mean losing half of my soul. The thought I will lose her one day is quite terrifying.. I hope one day Indonesians will learn that dogs will never cause any harm to human as long as they treated well. Dog is cute, lovable creature, dog is a natural healer. Proven to help me going through my depression stages most of the time. Dog won't care about our background and our dark past whether we are poor or rich, they just love us just by the way we are
                I am good, but not an angel. I do sin, but I am not the devil.i'm just.. human

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Jaime C View Post
                  Condolences on your loss.
                  Originally posted by Mister Bule View Post
                  So sorry to read this sad story, badak. In a short time you've learned how much love and happiness a dog can bring, and how much sadness comes with the loss. Don't give up on keeping a dog, though. Take some time to recover from the loss and hurt and maybe you and your family will be ready to try again.
                  Originally posted by yardmaster View Post
                  sorry to hear your sad story Badaktempur, she was a lovely pup.
                  Originally posted by Alia View Post
                  RIP Ruby, Boncel my dog who also left me when I was a kid will play along with you there at the dog palace.
                  thanks jamie, misterbule, yardmaster and alia. thanks everyone.. yeah we're both still grieving, and its even very hard for my wife as she still had some nightmares about it even until last night

                  well back to the topic, at least my experience shows that not every indonesian is weird when it comes to dogs. at first its hard, especially when my wife make the puppy sleep in our room, but then slowly i can get along, need lots of tolerance between me and my wife. i know theres a hadits about cleaning with soil n everything but, i tried to make it simple. i want to pray, if i want to pray then i just take the wudhu, even when my dog sniff on me then i just take another wudhu n ran like hell avoiding her to the room that restricted for dogs, because i pray there.. but thats it, we all laugh about it. and that just one story of how some mutual understanding can actually help us indonesians less weird when it comes to dogs.

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                  • #54
                    [QUOTE=
                    Are you going to keep a dog as a novelty or abuse the animal? If so, that is prohibited. Are you instead going to make the dog useful and compliment its life? If so, that is permissible. May Allah (subhana wa ta'ala) guide you in this matter; my advice is tainted in some fashion or another.[/QUOTE]

                    That sounds like pretty good advice to me.
                    Some of the chapters of my life are pretty boring but some of the pages are fascinating.

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                    • #55
                      thediamond & badaktempur

                      I'm sorry for your loss
                      I never have any dogs but I do love cats and rabbits.
                      Some of them left or died, and I know how you feel .

                      About being weird,
                      I have to admit yes we can be weird when it comes to dogs
                      Because as DaninAceh said, their saliva is najis.
                      So, after I touch them I always take a big shower and put my clothes in laundry afterwards.
                      But, I do love dogs! Especially the big ones, like Oprah's (saw them on TV).
                      They're sooo cute.
                      My late grandma, who's half Dutch half Javanese also had 3 dogs, but they were a little bit galak so I didn't play much with them.
                      My mom's friend who's Muslim also love dogs, she has one pug and one husky, I played with them a little when I visited her house.
                      I remember the husky was a kid (wasn't a puppy too haha), but he's already grown big, tall! And he acted cute with me I was scared!
                      Scared cos his head were bigger than mine hahaha... And he was acting cute wanting me to hug him, that was cuteee...
                      We took a pic together then. And as with the pug, I let her sit on my lap for a while, she seemed to be enjoying it.

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                      • #56
                        I'm especially un-fond of dogs that lick incessantly. Their owners will say [Snarky Voice] "His mouth is cleaner then yours". I'm thinking; I don't lick my butt!
                        Some of the chapters of my life are pretty boring but some of the pages are fascinating.

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Interloper View Post
                          Their owners will say [Snarky Voice] "His mouth is cleaner then yours". I'm thinking; I don't lick my butt!
                          I don't allow my dog to lick my face. he usually resort to licking toes and hands instead.
                          Indeed, canine's saliva actually contain Lysozyme that kills nasty bacteria. However, the dog/wolf must also be healthy lest the saliva also brings out nasty germs incl. herpes.

                          Dogs lick their butts (cats too) to groom themselves. they don't know how to use toilet paper to clean themselves after they went no. 1 or no. 2. So? what do they have? they're tongue.
                          [COLOR=black]
                          [/COLOR]

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by sweetmaria View Post
                            I don't allow my dog to lick my face. he usually resort to licking toes and hands instead.
                            Indeed, canine's saliva actually contain Lysozyme that kills nasty bacteria. However, the dog/wolf must also be healthy lest the saliva also brings out nasty germs incl. herpes.

                            Dogs lick their butts (cats too) to groom themselves. they don't know how to use toilet paper to clean themselves after they went no. 1 or no. 2. So? what do they have? they're tongue.
                            This post is detracting from the original thread which is 'why are some indonesians so weird when it comes to dogs'. Please stick to the original topic next time. Its a shame that the moderators cant do their job properly and prevent offensive comments re butt licking (as duly noted above).

                            I think that I might apply to be a mod. I understand fully the legal aspects of the job

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by advancebooking View Post
                              This post is detracting from the original thread which is 'why are some indonesians so weird when it comes to dogs'. Please stick to the original topic next time. Its a shame that the moderators cant do their job properly and prevent offensive comments re butt licking (as duly noted above).

                              I think that I might apply to be a mod. I understand fully the legal aspects of the job

                              I can just see it now, if we don't say what you want, you'll delete our posts.
                              The answer is 42 .... any questions? .

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