Retirement Visa Questions

**Davita** · 15-04-09, 20:26

Today I went to a Travel Agent's Jakarta office to talk about applying for a Retirement Visa.
He said he has done hundreds of these Visas. A friend of mine used him successfully but, unfortunately, he is in the States till next month.
The cost for each of us is IDR 8,500,000 for everything, including a 6 month exit/re-entry visa. A new 6 month exit/re-entry is IDR 1.200,000.
This needs to be repeated every year.
He said there has never been any problem and says most of his clients do NOT apply for an NPWP, they just pay the fiscal.
He guaranteed that his office provides all the documents and deals with Immigration, all I need is to offer my passport for copying and provide some pictures, and pay the fee.

It seems very expensive and I just wondered if there was a cheaper way or just using a Sosbud would suffice. I know that extensions could get difficult, and visa runs could ultimately be a pain, but I wouldn't need the NPWP nor worry about fiscal and re-entry costs.
Are there any other benefits that I would miss by staying with the Sosbud.

Appreciate any help on making this decision.

Confused David

**atlantis** · 16-04-09, 05:10

A few ideas to reduce the cost:
- You pay 8,5 juta (or any amount negociated) to get a Retirement Visa (index 319) for YOU with this agent or another one.

- As soon as you get your KITAS you apply directly or via an agent for a KITAS for your wife as a dependent souse (index 317). Being yourself her sponsor, it will drop the cost drastically:

if you decide to deal alone with the Imigrasi, I'll help you to get it for the official cost of it (ie: IDR 700.000), which would allow you to save about 7 millions, even if we include a MERP (exit/re entry permit)!
if you decide to deal with an agent for your wife also, a dependant visa (VITAS ikut suami) shouldn't cost you more than 3 or 4 millions, meaning that you save already a few millions from the 8,5 juta quoted for her.

A spouse of a KITAS holder has a guaranteed right to get a KITAS providing that she is legally married with him. No conditions apart this one. It means that it is way "cheaper" to arrange for a KITAS for her, not having to pay for a "sponsor fee".

- The Izin Masuk Kembali (MERP) for 6 months is "easy" to deal with and only cost IDR 600.000 per person if you arrange it yourself. It requires a couple of trips to the adminitrations involved with it but is no big deal. However including a 6 month validity is a wrong advice, just to force you to have to deal with another 6 months MERP with them at the cost of 1.200.000 (which is twice its price by the way). Your KITAS being valid for 1 year, you should ask them to include a 1 year MERP in the deal which has an official fee of IDR 1.000.000 per person (just IDR 400.000 more than the 6 months MERP, at the official fee), or to exclude it from the deal (meaning taking off 1,2 jt from the quoted price, since it is their quotation for it), then deal yourself with it at the Imigrasi.

I should be in JKT in a week from now or so (should be confirmed this week end). If you are interested, we can meet at my hotel and I'll explain you better what are the possibilities you have to reduce the cost of it, or arguments you may bring to the agent to "bargain" with him.
Let me know if you are interested. From where I stand, there is many ways to makeit cheaper, depending on how much you are willing to be involved.

**ohmdafyd** · 16-04-09, 06:43

Originally Posted by atlantis

A few ideas to reduce the cost:
- You pay 8,5 juta (or any amount negociated) to get a Retirement Visa (index 319) for YOU with this agent or another one.

- As soon as you get your KITAS you apply directly or via an agent for a KITAS for your wife as a dependent souse (index 317). Being yourself her sponsor, it will drop the cost drastically:

if you decide to deal alone with the Imigrasi, I'll help you to get it for the official cost of it (ie: IDR 700.000), which would allow you to save about 7 millions, even if we include a MERP (exit/re entry permit)!
if you decide to deal with an agent for your wife also, a dependant visa (VITAS ikut suami) shouldn't cost you more than 3 or 4 millions, meaning that you save already a few millions from the 8,5 juta quoted for her.

A spouse of a KITAS holder has a guaranteed right to get a KITAS providing that she is legally married with him. No conditions apart this one. It means that it is way "cheaper" to arrange for a sponsor

- The Izin Masuk Kembali (MERP) for 6 months is "easy" to deal with and only cost IDR 600.000 per person if you arrange it yourself. It requires a couple of trips to the adminitrations involved with it but is no big deal. However including a 6 month validity is a wrong advice, just to force you to have to deal with another 6 months MERP with them at the cost of 1.200.000 (which is twice its price by the way). Your KITAS being valid for 1 year, you should ask them to include a 1 year MERP in the deal which has an official fee of IDR 1.000.000 per person (just IDR 400.000 more than the 6 months MERP, at the official fee), or to exclude it from the deal (meaning taking off 1,2 jt from the quoted price, since it is their quotation for it), then deal yourself with it at the Imigrasi.

I should be in JKT in a week from now or so (should be confirmed this week end). If you are interested, we can meet at my hotel and I'll explain you better what are the possibilities you have to reduce the cost of it, or arguments you may bring to the agent to "bargain" with him.
Let me know if you are interested. From where I stand, there is many ways to makeit cheaper, depending on how much you are willing to be involved.

Davita,
just to add some gratuitous advice, my partner and I have followed the advice given by Atlantis to the letter in trying to stop the extortion by Immigrasi here whilst extending my Sosbud, and it worked!
Now we only pay the official fees, it just takes a willingness to do it, ensuring that all required paperwork is submitted in full and on time, and put up with them running you around and showing unhappy faces for a little while...the look on their faces is well worth it alone, trust me.

**Davita** · 16-04-09, 10:23

Atlantis
Thanks a million for your advice...I am already relieved.
I thought I read somewhere information about the spouse Kitas being cheaper.
I would love to meet with you (Lunch or Dinner on me) and develop a strategy. Please PM your Jakarta schedule info.
I only start my Bahasa Indonesia language course on 27 April so I don't think I'll be proficient when we meet...and my best French is 'ouvrer la porte' and 'fermer la fenetre', so Angletere it will have to be.

I crunched some approximate numbers on Retirement versus Sosbud Plans:

Retirement visa

Me (Agent): (8,500,000) Spouse (Agent): (4,000,000)
Total: (12,500,000)

Note: No hassle; Problem resolving NPWP or Fiscal; Can arrange 2nd exit/re-entry myself; Future Visas can probably bargain; Opportunity for Kitap; In and out privilege.

Sosbud

Me: Tickets to KL and Airport fees X 2 (2,600,000)
Transport between Airports X 4 (600,000)
Visa x 2 (1,000,000) Extension to Visa x 8 (2,000,000)
Transport to Tangerang Immigrasi x 16 (3,000,000)

Spouse: Visa X 2 (1,000,000) Extension to Visa X 8 (2,000,000)

Total(12,200,000)

Note: Plenty hassle; Possibility of not going smooth; No Kitas; No problem with NPWP or Fiscal; Same next year; No opportunity for Kitap; No in and out privilege except for another Visa.

Anyone like to comment and, is my reasoning and math OK.

relieved David

**marcus** · 16-04-09, 10:38

I'm on Sosbud for about 7 years already , no relevant problem up to now . For the same cost I would choose the Retirement Visa , but I spend about Rp6,5 million per year for the visas/extensions/.. and my citizenship and house don't comply with the Retirement Visa requirements . Doing all by myself is not a problem as , here in Bandung , going to Imigrasi is easy and cheap , I don't spend much time there , going to Kuala Lumpur has some advantages , I had no problem to open bank account and even got a BCA credit card (had to make a "deposito" for just one year) .

**Davita** · 16-04-09, 15:32

Marcus,
Thanks for your information. Sorry to hear your citizenship does not qualify for Retirement Visa. Kinda limits your options.
I'm leaning towards accepting the Agents proposal but want to be able to negotiate a lower fee.

Cheap Charlie David

**atlantis** · 16-04-09, 16:18

Originally Posted by marcus

and my citizenship and house don't comply with the Retirement Visa requirements

I may have a good news for you Marcus... You are brasilian, correct? If I guess right, your citizenship is eligible. For the South American continent, three countries are eligible: Argentina, Surinam and Brasil. This is for the citizenship. For the house and employees, bear in mind that what is required is merely a statement that you are renting/owning a house with the requested value. Anyway, anyone dealing with an agent will have these details taken care of by the agent. Hence the price one pay.

**atlantis** · 16-04-09, 16:28

David,
Consider it a deal. I'll try my best to hide my french accent and use (almost) correct english. There is 75% chance that my trip to JKT get confirmed. I'll let you know asap.
I spent part of the day in my local KanIm. I met there a young chap (foreigner) who had real hard time with Imigrasi. They gave him real headaches having him, his wife and their three months son waiting from this morning untill mid afternoon for nothing! I spent 2 hours explaining him basic rules and laws. He had been screwed by some of the bad guys in the Imigrasi for the past 5 months.

I wonder if things will ever change...

**marcus** · 16-04-09, 17:00

Originally Posted by atlantis

I may have a good news for you Marcus... You are brasilian, correct? If I guess right, your citizenship is eligible. .................................................. ...:

Correct , Atlantis , but I am not exactly happy about as the cost is still not attractive . But thanks anyway . Very soon I will probably use your other tips on KITAS sponsored by Indonesian wife .

**atlantis** · 16-04-09, 17:17

Costs are always dependant on how much you need an agent for doing the paperwork. The KITAS by itself costs only IDR 700.000. Anything above are facilitation fees (call it a bribe) and the agent fee.
I understand your point however. As long as one is confortable with visa runs and that Kantor Imigrasi and Kantor Wilayah are still easily accessible from one's house, a sosbud is quite appealing. I have been staying long enough with SosBud and enjoyed it.
In your particular case, no doubt that if you marry, the KITAS sponsored by an Indonesian wife is by far the best deal.