Change of Position - IMTA

[lantern]

Think Lantern meant somebody from the competition, or a disgruntled employee perhaps, might have warned the ministry. Like informan.

agent provocateur, betrayer, blabbermouth,canary, decoy, deep throat, double-crosser, fink,fink, informant, informer, narc, narc, nark, nark, plant, police informer, rat, rat fink, shill, sneak, snitch, snitcher, source, spy, squealer,squealer, stoolie, tattler, tattletale,tipster, turncoat, weasel, whistle-blower

Correct. They just seem to be paying the individual a lot of attention so I was wondering what's the motivation ?

[roswen]

Thanks Roswen
Dont you think it's kinda weird that our lawyers cant give any other suggestion rather than Leave the working area? the main reason is we have an internal issue among the shareholders anyway - someone's ego to be exact. Tht's why on the same day PD plus 2 directors are requested to leave the working area with different reasons but the same punishment. you know, money talk

I dont want/hope this would happen in the future again... it's like disaster.

Well, i think leave the working area is the only option you have. I don't know and can't answer or suggest anything. But, If I were you, I would ask my lawyer for every single corporate action of the company before the company doing that action. If you have legal department in you company, then you don't need to ask a lawyer. Did you retain your lawyer or not? for your information, I only retain my lawyer for only 3000US$ every month, for 2 years but he gives so much benefit for me, like helping me draft an agreement, shareholder resolution, prepare legal opinion. As I said, when you have legal department/retain a lawyer, then use them for every corporate action or legal action that the company will do. If not, then this problem will happen almost every time.

For me, as a business man, there is nothing you can do than leave the working area, since i notice you already did the lobby, etc. If you are able to pay the authority, then do so. If not, then it is your company fault and it is the rule. the other suggestion from me is by appointing nominee director, or i think when all the director is not available, then the commissioner could take in charge. I think thats all the option available for you right now until the IMTA is completed. The next is you need to expedite the process of IMTA.

I don't know if you are retain a lawyer or not, but i could pm you my lawyer contact, if you want to.

[PhilippeD]

Thanks Roswen
Dont you think it's kinda weird that our lawyers cant give any other suggestion rather than Leave the working area? the main reason is we have an internal issue among the shareholders anyway - someone's ego to be exact. Tht's why on the same day PD plus 2 directors are requested to leave the working area with different reasons but the same punishment. you know, money talk

I dont want/hope this would happen in the future again... it's like disaster.

Earlier you said you had the "ok" from the manpower for the temporary position while the paper change process.
Now telling it have an internal issue between some share holder... no need to search more far, someone pay the manpower for they request the PD to leave the place for put pressure on other party.

Like I said in my first post, I'm surprise they don't ask him to leave the country. An habitual infraction almost always lead to an expulsion of the country (all visa cancelled).

My guess is someone from the inside is making the trouble.

[misano]

Now telling it have an internal issue between some share holder... no need to search more far, someone pay the manpower for they request the PD to leave the place for put pressure on other party.

Like I said in my first post, I'm surprise they don't ask him to leave the country. An habitual infraction almost always lead to an expulsion of the country (all visa cancelled).

My guess is someone from the inside is making the trouble.

Yes. We had ‘an exception’ from the manpower ministry during the transition. I thought from beginning I stated that there is an internal issue, and badly I’d composed a wrong question btw

Basically, I would like to know if anyone has the same experience with the changing position on their IMTA. I personally not so happy with our lawyers’ suggestion to follow the order said cz it means we disregards the law, and we are not.

Of course they can’t request them to leave the country because the one who can request someone to leave country is the immigration. This is an extra ordinary case; they made us have no choice. Once we disregard, Manpower will make recommendation to Immigration with bla..bla.. reason so our expatriates should leave the country… tht's the worst could be happened.

[misano]

If you have legal department in you company, then you don't need to ask a lawyer. Did you retain your lawyer or not? for your information, I only retain my lawyer for only 3000US$ every month, for 2 years but he gives so much benefit for me, like helping me draft an agreement, shareholder resolution, prepare legal opinion. As I said, when you have legal department/retain a lawyer, then use them for every corporate action or legal action that the company will do. If not, then this problem will happen almost every time.


I don't know if you are retain a lawyer or not, but i could pm you my lawyer contact, if you want to.

We have legal and we have 3 lawyers (paid per hour). however, it's nothing if you just touching someone's ego.
We have money, but it's not our attitude. we are in the right position, and play with no money consequently will make it harder to solve plus long process. So tired...

[roswen]

We have legal and we have 3 lawyers (paid per hour). however, it's nothing if you just touching someone's ego.
We have money, but it's not our attitude. we are in the right position, and play with no money consequently will make it harder to solve plus long process. So tired...

yeah lol.. I asked my lawyer, and he said your lawyer are in the right place misano (my bad for the incorrect typo). Have you done IMTA mutation? and I read your first post that it took almost a year? for IMTA process or what? and it is a common case that someone reporting to ministry of manpower regarding your expatriate. And yes, by coordinating with the immigration, Ministry of Manpower can do such action (ask your PD to leave).

[misano]

Have you done IMTA mutation? and I read your first post that it took almost a year? for IMTA process or what? and it is a common case that someone reporting to ministry of manpower regarding your expatriate. And yes, by coordinating with the immigration, Ministry of Manpower can do such action (ask your PD to leave).

So it’s all about the “money talk”, right?
And yes. We have done with that on Feb ’12 afterward the dispute raised on Apr and then… Everything which not makes any sense attacked us. I won’t discuss this further cz very crucial and private.

Before applied for the Mutation of IMTA, there some steps to be applied 1) apply for recommendation of switch position request to the ministry and have to be attached by copy of Deed decision of the shareholder meeting (this part take some times) and receipt data changes of company by the ministry of Justice and human rights. 2) change title position on the KITAS. 3) apply for new IMTA.

Hey, it seems you know better about legal case (I saw some of your comments on other thread). Hope that it would be fine if I ask you perhaps… am new in the Legal world

[roswen]

So it’s all about the “money talk”, right?
And yes. We have done with that on Feb ’12 afterward the dispute raised on Apr and then… Everything which not makes any sense attacked us. I won’t discuss this further cz very crucial and private.

Before applied for the Mutation of IMTA, there some steps to be applied 1) apply for recommendation of switch position request to the ministry and have to be attached by copy of Deed decision of the shareholder meeting (this part take some times) and receipt data changes of company by the ministry of Justice and human rights. 2) change title position on the KITAS. 3) apply for new IMTA.

Hey, it seems you know better about legal case (I saw some of your comments on other thread). Hope that it would be fine if I ask you perhaps… am new in the Legal world

lol, that's what your lawyer are for right? well, I don't know about legal case if it didn't happen to me. I might help you, but as long as I have experience about it in my business. I answer your case because I have a meeting with my lawyer this morning, and do a little chit chat. but for further explanation, of course my retainer's hour will be used, and I don't want it happen only to solve other people problems,..

You'd better start thinking about restructuring your legal department and your hourly lawyer.. I know it sounds rude, but when you are a business owner like me, then you will know how it feels. And tell your boss, find a good lawyer is easy, but useful lawyer is very hard.

cheers.

[misano]

LOL.. you can charge me Roswen just kidding anyway!
I mean I can ask you on case that you had previously by mentioning in this forum. dunno yet hw this website really work

on my concern, before decide to choose certain Lawyer Firm it's good to know their skill.
meaning that you know in which part they're good for reliable i.e good in criminal case but weak in agreement matters etc.
tht's wht you find difficult finding useful lawyer as I do

[atlantis]

Like I said in my first post, I'm surprise they don't ask him to leave the country. An habitual infraction almost always lead to an expulsion of the country (all visa cancelled).

I am not surprised by it. Nakertrans has no authority to order a deportation. They can only ask you to leave the working area. For this, they have a competence. Next step, if you don't comply, would be for them to inform and coordinate an action with Imigrasi.

Marcus, the Imta contain many information about the work position:
The title and all city where you will work must are part of it.
Any change on the work position without change to the IMTA can lead to your expulsion.

On this case they are very nice as they don't seem to ask him to leave the country.
Look like someone is searching for bride...

Misano, the only advise I can give you is for the next time your company want change someone position:
- New position appointed in the shareholder meeting
- Ask for the relevant change in IMTA
- Wait for the change are accepted before made any official change in the company. (I don't see why it must not be more long than asking for a new IMTA)
- While the change is in precess you can "upgrade" (not too much - you need to stay on the scope of managerial profession that fit with the title) the job description of the person WITHOUT change is title. If my memory is good, the IMTA don't have a detailed description of the work made under the position.

In short, it's more easy to change the work scope than the title!

lol. Good one.