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  • Originally posted by Kimdub View Post
    This is where I have to stop myself. I am very critical of countries that open their borders to groups that don't even try to assimilate to the host country. So if we choose to live here, we accept the local customs and laws. However, this does not mean that we shouldn't be able to express our personal views.

    The growing conservatism and what I call the increasing Arab influence I have noticed since living here does concern me. Tourism and business investment that can help improve the country will not be helped by such laws as banning alcohol. I just wish the emphasis was on things like fighting corruption, infrastruture improvements and health care would take priority over what seem to be religiously inspired actions.
    here here ! i was going to add the same points myself re corruption etc , if the powers that be fill the peoples minds with religious mumbo jumbo , maybe they will forget their lack of water , power , the broken road which hasnt been fixed for the last 5 years , what are we going to eat today etc.

    Comment


    • [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman][COLOR=#000000]HiAnglian, thread #241[/COLOR]
      [COLOR=#000000]forshure , u may be wonder about the better choice which one is morehealthy: alcohol/beer or a sweet drink. [/COLOR]


      [COLOR=#000000]Making this determination depens on several factors, such as your health,age and the type of alcohol and that soft drink. ( just trying toavoid to be stemple as "preachingand brainwashing" ) so let's try to make coorelation more have a reasonable discuss,

      the key from what u're saying that the kids- your concern right? then conservative muslim...then fat kids....[/COLOR]


      [/FONT][/SIZE]
      • [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman][COLOR=#000000]Pregnant women should avoid alcohol, because of potential risks to the baby caused by these substances. Children should also avoid alcohol and caffeinated beverages because they have a negative health impact on their developing bodies. People with certain diseases, such as hepatitis C, or liver or kidney conditions should also avoid alcohol because it puts stress on the liver and kidneys. [/COLOR] [/FONT][/SIZE]
      • [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman][COLOR=#000000]No alcoholic beverage or soda/sweet drink has much nutritional value, If you drink too much alcohol, you may damage organs like your liver. Alcohol can cloud your thinking, which can lead to poor decision-making as well as slow your physical responses, and this can be dangerous if you plan to drive. ---> my previous post u can see the EU made a rapport about this. [/COLOR]http://ec.europa.eu/health/ph_determ...ctsheet_en.pdf[/FONT][/SIZE]
      • [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman][COLOR=#000000]Danish healhty afdeling/ministry rapport : https://sundhedsstyrelsen.dk/da/nyhe...ald-af-alkohol --> more than [/COLOR][COLOR=#000000]27.000 ppl had been contact ( 2013) in the hospital cause of alcohol related diseasse


        [/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE]

      [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman]
      [COLOR=#373737][COLOR=#c5000b]forthose who might assume my wife is a bad Muslim she prays a lot, atleast twice a day, even at 4.30am.....

      [/COLOR][/COLOR]
      [COLOR=#000000]Uno need to prove and said that to those who might assume your wife.As i understand that your wife is a muslim...so that's her choice andher privat to drink and keep to prays etc. I won't said it'swrong..its up to God to decide. So try not to much to assume something u don't really know abt that. because as a muslim, we had no capabelity or has no right to judge others muslim....we has a responsibelity to advice or to give opinion but it's between the individu self and God[/COLOR]

      [COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#c5000b]doyou thing there is some tie up between fat kids and people andconservative Islam -[/COLOR]-->[/COLOR]
      [COLOR=#000000] tryto make more logic coorelation. Conservative muslim vs Fat kids. Anyfact that prove your assumpstion or else it's just nonsense![/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE]
      Last edited by sunflower20; 30-05-16, 07:55.
      [COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
      [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]The road doesn't go where you planned. It goes where it's written to be[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
      [/FONT][/COLOR]

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Daniel50 View Post
        I am not sure which places sell alcohol in Indonesia, but if they choose to restrict outlets eg. minimarkets and supermarkets then this should be there right as different provinces etc. have the right to set there bylaws. If some people feel this inconveniences them then so be it.

        i'd been living in denmark since 2005 and in that time, i never see any alcohol in supermarket, except in a big supermarkets like carrefour, ..most i 'd seen in pub /bar or hotel, like hard rock cafe in jakarta...last year i was in holiday that i saw some mini markets sell alcohol etc.

        Now i've often see some alcohol product from my friends's post in facebook,ig,etc. .I assume now alcohol it's more a familiar for young ppl in the big cities as jakarta ..but i don't know. i think it's a good idea to make a preventif step to avoid the problem tobe more big. as i understand, the system not ready yet to put an effort on a strict laws about alcohol, put the infra structure for the police, doctor etc, and the important thing is about the education for people. it needs a huge budget for all of that. . so that's why the legisatif just make a solution to ban alcohol ( maybe) ...

        and i agree..Corruption is the biggest problem that the government need to focus on......
        [COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
        [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]The road doesn't go where you planned. It goes where it's written to be[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
        [/FONT][/COLOR]

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Kimdub View Post
          just wish the emphasis was on things like fighting corruption, infrastruture improvements and health care would take priority over what seem to be religiously inspired actions.

          corruption...hmmmm, hard to say it will be happen very soon:-D ..
          infrastructure improvements and should be with all ppl have responsible to take care and maintenance that infrastructure.
          health care system : this is my biggest dream ...hope it will be free to go to the hospital and doctor...
          and free school ....

          Aameen.....
          [COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
          [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]The road doesn't go where you planned. It goes where it's written to be[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
          [/FONT][/COLOR]

          Comment


          • Originally posted by sunflower20 View Post
            corruption...hmmmm, hard to say it will be happen very soon:-D ..
            infrastructure improvements and should be with all ppl have responsible to take care and maintenance that infrastructure.
            health care system : this is my biggest dream ..[COLOR="#FF0000"]hope it will be free to go to the hospital and doctor....
            and free school ....[/COLOR]

            Aameen.....
            Nothing in life is free...someone, somewhere has to provide and pay. The question most debated is WHO should pay.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by sunflower20 View Post
              [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman][COLOR=#000000]HiAnglian, thread #241[/COLOR]
              [COLOR=#000000]forshure , u may be wonder about the better choice which one is morehealthy: alcohol/beer or a sweet drink. [/COLOR]


              [COLOR=#000000]Making this determination depens on several factors, such as your health,age and the type of alcohol and that soft drink. ( just trying toavoid to be stemple as "preachingand brainwashing" ) so let's try to make coorelation more have a reasonable discuss,

              the key from what u're saying that the kids- your concern right? then conservative muslim...then fat kids....[/COLOR]


              [/FONT][/SIZE]
              • [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman][COLOR=#000000]Pregnant women should avoid alcohol, because of potential risks to the baby caused by these substances. Children should also avoid alcohol and caffeinated beverages because they have a negative health impact on their developing bodies. People with certain diseases, such as hepatitis C, or liver or kidney conditions should also avoid alcohol because it puts stress on the liver and kidneys. [/COLOR] [/FONT][/SIZE]
              • [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman][COLOR=#000000]No alcoholic beverage or soda/sweet drink has much nutritional value, If you drink too much alcohol, you may damage organs like your liver. Alcohol can cloud your thinking, which can lead to poor decision-making as well as slow your physical responses, and this can be dangerous if you plan to drive. ---> my previous post u can see the EU made a rapport about this. [/COLOR]http://ec.europa.eu/health/ph_determ...ctsheet_en.pdf[/FONT][/SIZE]
              • [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman][COLOR=#000000]Danish healhty afdeling/ministry rapport : https://sundhedsstyrelsen.dk/da/nyhe...ald-af-alkohol --> more than [/COLOR][COLOR=#000000]27.000 ppl had been contact ( 2013) in the hospital cause of alcohol related diseasse


                [/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE]

              [SIZE=3][FONT=times new roman]

              [COLOR=#000000]Uno need to prove and said that to those who might assume your wife.As i understand that your wife is a muslim...so that's her choice andher privat to drink and keep to prays etc. I won't said it'swrong..its up to God to decide. So try not to much to assume something u don't really know abt that. because as a muslim, we had no capabelity or has no right to judge others muslim....we has a responsibelity to advice or to give opinion but it's between the individu self and God[/COLOR]


              [COLOR=#000000] tryto make more logic coorelation. Conservative muslim vs Fat kids. Anyfact that prove your assumpstion or else it's just nonsense![/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE]
              Dear oh dear, what a ramble, the remark about fat kids and Islam was tongue in cheek and and sensible person could see that, it is against the law in UK and most of Europe illegal for children to buy alcohol, 18years in UK, and in the US various states I believe 21 years, so your beliefs of young kids running round freely drinking alcohol is widely of the mark, plus most women in the UK and US are fully aware of the dangers of drinking alcohol. Now soft drinks, people particularly becoming aware of the dangers of soft drinks that contain massive amounts of sugar, so much so that the British government has imposed reluctantly, a tax on sugary drinks, despite the soft drinks companies trying to stop the government to do this. So your idea that majority of people who drink alcohol are suffering all sorts of organ failure is ridiculous, my great grandfather, grandfather and father great Aunt all drank, and lived well into there nineties, So please get a life and stop worrying, Obesity is the problem now, a major problem which really puts Alcohol in the shade,
              Last edited by Anglian; 30-05-16, 08:27.

              Comment


              • we pay it, it from the taxes...but againbcomes to the point nr 1. the corruption...so it won't happen also....
                [COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
                [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]The road doesn't go where you planned. It goes where it's written to be[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
                [/FONT][/COLOR]

                Comment


                • Anglian #261

                  i reply to the post u wrote about
                  the tie between ... #241
                  ....it was a tongue cheeks..ok...but it's just funny to said something without any thinking u will get some comments...and no...for europe, uk and us..i do not believe it will be happend....in Indonesia...who knows?..since i had seen a picture of children smoking cigrettes..

                  and about the soft drinks...it's not the actual problem in denmark. at least danish government has a control for that. from the elementary school we get any informations about the sugar u are consume and the effects in your body,etc....it already has a program a least every six months, the children get a control and chek to the dentist and school program always invites dentist, doctor and others experts to explain about it.

                  It's not my idea to make a conclusion aabt alcohol..it was the EU rapport that wrote: Harmful alcohol use is the 3rd biggest cause of earlydeath and illness in the EU, behind tobacco and highblood pressure.

                  So...why i need to worrying ..that i m not drink at all... i just concern....come on!.....i have a good life and i no need to worry.... #peace
                  and i agree with u that obesitas now is a problem in UK...( i used to see a program about embrassing bodies )
                  [COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
                  [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]The road doesn't go where you planned. It goes where it's written to be[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#1D2129][FONT=helvetica]
                  [/FONT][/COLOR]

                  Comment


                  • Children smoking and drinking is the parents problems. The biggest issue is with people not wanting to take responsibility for their actions. People want the government or someone else to be blamed and to do the work.

                    All of this discussion is based on the common mindset that someone else, anyone else, other than the individual need to take care of the individual.

                    Comment


                    • News today from Jakarta Post page 2....

                      If passed, law will impose full nationwide ban on production, distribution, consumption of drinks with 1%-55% alcohol content House expects to pass bill by July 28.


                      “The title will be deliberated later to speed up the process,” said leader of a House special committee for the alcohol prohibition bill, Mohammad Arwani Thomafi, a lawmaker from the United Development Party (PPP) which, together with fellow Islamoriented party the Prosperous Justice Party (PKS), has sponsored the bill.

                      Comment


                      • Mod note - a few posts deleted - unfriendly, bickering, junior modding - pending the real thing. Don't forget folks - there is such a thing as the report button.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Davita View Post
                          News today from Jakarta Post page 2....

                          If passed, law will impose full nationwide ban on production, distribution, consumption of drinks with 1%-55% alcohol content House expects to pass bill by July 28.
                          Suddenly every place in Bali carries 151

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Davita View Post
                            News today from Jakarta Post page 2....

                            If passed, law will impose full nationwide ban on production, distribution, consumption of drinks with 1%-55% alcohol content House expects to pass bill by July 28.
                            Rather than banning the production and consumption of Alkohol I believe that the government should ban papers which propagate wrong or incomplete information.

                            For the record the ban is not nationwide and a lot of exceptions exists. Here is how the draft reads:

                            Pasal 8

                            (1) Larangan sebagaimana dimaksud dalam Pasal 5, Pasal 6, dan Pasal 7 tidak berlaku untuk kepentingan terbatas.

                            (2) Kepentingan terbatas sebagaimana dimaksud pada ayat (1) meliputi:

                            a. kepentingan adat
                            b. ritual keagamaan
                            c. wisatawan;
                            d. farmasi, dan
                            e. tempat-tempat yang diizinkan oleh peraturan perundang-undangan.

                            (3) Ketentuan lebih lanjut mengenai kepentingan terbatas sebagaimana dimaksud pada ayat (2) diatur dalam Peraturan Pemerintah



                            The elucidation also adds the below:

                            Huruf e

                            Yang dimaksud dengan “tempat-tempat yang diizinkan oleh peraturan perundang-undangan meliputi toko bebas bea, hotel bintang 5 (lima), restoran dengan tanda talam kencana dan talam selaka, bar, pub, klub malam, dan toko khusus penjualan Minuman Beralkohol



                            The only thing that this ban may achieve, if the law is passed, is, as it has been said, an increase in the production of bootleg alkohol and an increase in price for the legit stuff.

                            Comment


                            • I think Atlantis this is what members of the forum have trying to say to our Muslim friends, as you've pointed out a ban is totally counter productive, the countries were it is banned is full of illegal stills and a thriving industry of the manufacture and sale of illegal hooch, or as its called "Sediki" which I think is Arabic for friend, some friend, there are many ilgal brewing activities going on in Indonesia now, imagine the explosion of illegal brewing if alcohol is banned, the authorities have no control now, so what will happen if totally banned will be a total flood, plus a mega increase in corruption
                              Last edited by Anglian; 31-05-16, 16:30.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by atlantis View Post
                                Rather than banning the production and consumption of Alkohol I believe that the government should ban papers which propagate wrong or incomplete information.

                                For the record the ban is not nationwide and a lot of exceptions exists. Here is how the draft reads:.....
                                For those of us that don't speak Bahasa could you give us the gist of what your post/the actual proposed law says?

                                Comment

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