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The Muslim Nation Where ISIS is Free to Recruit

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  • The Muslim Nation Where ISIS is Free to Recruit

    More great headlines for the International community.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/news/isis-lea...slim-impunity/

    [COLOR=#202022][FONT=Georgia]"CIANJUR, Indonesia -- A businessman who proclaims himself leader of the Indonesian chapter of the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) group says he has personally overseen the departure of scores of fighters from this Southeast Asian nation to Syria and Iraq. Police detained him for a night recently, but were unable to charge him with a crime.[/FONT][/COLOR]
    [COLOR=#202022][FONT=Georgia]Chep Hernawan reflects both the success ISIS has had in attracting support in the region, and the challenges Indonesia faces in responding."[/FONT][/COLOR]
    [COLOR=#333333][FONT=Verdana]Some love to milk Apostate.[/FONT][/COLOR]

  • #2
    India presents a perplexing case in this regard. Indian shia Muslims going to protect their heritage in Iraq whilst Sunni are going to join ISIL. Source TV news.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by johntap View Post
      India presents a perplexing case in this regard. Indian shia Muslims going to protect their heritage in Iraq whilst Sunni are going to join ISIL. Source TV news.
      Care to elaborate on how that relates to the article about Indonesia specifically?
      [COLOR=#333333][FONT=Verdana]Some love to milk Apostate.[/FONT][/COLOR]

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      • #4
        No, But if you wish me to remove it I will.

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        • #5
          So no law about organising and/or supporting terrorist activities ?

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          • #6
            Originally posted by johntap View Post
            No, But if you wish me to remove it I will.
            Nope. Just do what you do.
            [COLOR=#333333][FONT=Verdana]Some love to milk Apostate.[/FONT][/COLOR]

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            • #7
              Originally posted by jimmi james View Post
              So no law about organising and/or supporting terrorist activities ?

              No laws what so ever it seems. Talk but no action yet and frankly, I doubt if anyone has any idea as to how to approach it with the make up of how laws seem to be looked at here when it come to a certain religion.
              [COLOR=#333333][FONT=Verdana]Some love to milk Apostate.[/FONT][/COLOR]

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              • #8
                Many countries are working on such laws eg

                https://www.google.com/search?q=law+...r+isis&spell=1

                Here is one extract from NY Times:
                Nations Trying to Stop Their Citizens From Going to Middle East to Fight for ISIS

                By SOMINI SENGUPTASEPT. 12, 2014
                UNITED NATIONS — France wants more power to block its citizens from leaving the country, while Britain is weighing whether to stop more of its citizens from coming home. Tunisia is debating measures to make it a criminal offense to help jihadist fighters travel to Syria and Iraq, while Russia has outlawed enlisting in armed groups that are “contradictory to Russian policy.” The rapid surge of the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria, and its ability to draw fighters from across the globe, have set off alarm bells in capitals worldwide. Countries that rarely see eye to eye are now trying to blunt its recruitment drive, passing a raft of new rules that they hope will stop their citizens from joining extremist groups abroad.
                The United States has seized on the issue, pushing for a legally binding United Nations Security Council resolution that would compel all countries in the world to take steps to “prevent and suppress” the flow of their citizens into the arms of groups considered to be terrorist organizations.

                Prime Minister David Cameron of Britain and President Obama at a NATO summit meeting in Newport, Wales, last week. Credit Jon Super/Associated Press Recruits from 74 countries are among the estimated 12,000 foreign militants in Syria and Iraq, many of them fighting with ISIS, according to Peter Neumann, a professor at King’s College London, who has culled the figures largely from government sources. The largest blocs of these fighters come from nearby Muslim countries, like Tunisia and Saudi Arabia, but smaller contingents come from countries as far away and disparate as Belgium, China, Russia and the United States.


                I SUSPECT THERE IS NO LAW IN THIS COUNTRY THAT CAN BE APPLIED.
                Last edited by johntap; 06-10-14, 21:16.

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                • #9
                  A further quick check reveals for the case here:

                  Wednesday, 06 August, 2014 | 11:02 WIB
                  Indonesia Prevents pro-ISIS Citizens from Travelling Overseas



                  [COLOR=#666666]TEMPO.CO[/COLOR], [COLOR=#666666]Jakarta[/COLOR] – The Indonesian government is now trying to prevent its citizens supporting the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) from going abroad.
                  “The key is how the government, including the Foreign Affairs Ministry, can take actions to prevent Indonesian citizens who clearly violate the law in Indonesia or in the country they will visit,” said Foreign Minister Marty Natalegawa on Tuesday.
                  According to Marty, the most important thing for the Foreign Affairs Ministry is mapping out the procedures on how an Indonesian can enter a country and violate its law. “The point is that Indonesia will cooperate with related agencies and embassies to prevent this kind of people from travelling abroad,” said Marty, adding that he could not provide details on the prevention measures as it could potentially stymie its effectiveness.
                  Marty guaranteed that the prevention measures would not affect Indonesians who travel overseas for recreation, study and working. “The procedures are only relevant for Indonesians who want to go to war overseas,” said Marty.
                  Additionally, the Indonesian government has urged Indonesians to postpone trips to conflict-torn countries such as Libya, Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by johntap View Post
                    A further quick check reveals for the case here:

                    Wednesday, 06 August, 2014 | 11:02 WIB
                    Indonesia Prevents pro-ISIS Citizens from Travelling Overseas



                    [COLOR=#666666]TEMPO.CO[/COLOR], [COLOR=#666666]Jakarta[/COLOR] – The Indonesian government is now trying to prevent its citizens supporting the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) from going abroad.
                    “The key is how the government, including the Foreign Affairs Ministry, can take actions to prevent Indonesian citizens who clearly violate the law in Indonesia or in the country they will visit,” said Foreign Minister Marty Natalegawa on Tuesday.
                    According to Marty, the most important thing for the Foreign Affairs Ministry is mapping out the procedures on how an Indonesian can enter a country and violate its law. “The point is that Indonesia will cooperate with related agencies and embassies to prevent this kind of people from travelling abroad,” said Marty, adding that he could not provide details on the prevention measures as it could potentially stymie its effectiveness.
                    Marty guaranteed that the prevention measures would not affect Indonesians who travel overseas for recreation, study and working. “The procedures are only relevant for Indonesians who want to go to war overseas,” said Marty.
                    Additionally, the Indonesian government has urged Indonesians to postpone trips to conflict-torn countries such as Libya, Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan.
                    So, no actual laws to stop anyone saying they are traveling for non warfare. Do they think these guys are going to say, "hey, I am going to war so stop me." No. That is just like when they say it is illegal and one could lose their Indonesian citizenship if they give allegiance to any other government. So far, all apprehended have said they did not take the oath yet. Talk is cheap. Stating you didn't take the oath is SOP so you can't be held.

                    Government took their time recognizing the problem and since then have done nothing.
                    [COLOR=#333333][FONT=Verdana]Some love to milk Apostate.[/FONT][/COLOR]

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                    • #11
                      I imagine the Indonesian government could find a way to prevent travel directly to those two countries, but I'm sure a determined person could get around that. The return from those countries could be more easily controled, but by that time they are already trained and indoctrinated fighters. Then again I watched ISIS fighters burn thier passports after arriving in Syria. Maybe it is better to deal with like minded fanatics that are located in one place. Surround them cut off supplies and defeat them.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by yardmaster View Post
                        ... Maybe it is better to deal with like minded fanatics that are located in one place. Surround them cut off supplies and defeat them.
                        You'd think that would be easy. But if one air attack yields on average a humvee and a mortar installation it's gonna take a while. I'm sure we have all read that the air attacks just force the fighters deeper into the community.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by fastpitch17 View Post
                          No laws what so ever it seems. Talk but no action yet and frankly, I doubt if anyone has any idea as to how to approach it with the make up of how laws seem to be looked at here when it come to a certain religion.
                          Not so fast. They are not asleep at the wheel.
                          [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial]
                          [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial]"The government of the world’s biggest Muslim-majority nation has threatened to revoke the citizenship of Indonesians who join the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant, known as Isis, after a surge in support for the militant group.
                          [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial]
                          [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial]The police have increased their monitoring of those travelling to and from Turkey and other entry points to the Syrian conflict, and officials are working with the country’s leading Muslim organisations to counter pro-Isis propaganda on social media and at mosques.[/FONT][/COLOR]
                          [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial]“We have to be prepared for when Indonesians come back from fighting in the Middle East,” said Sri Yunanto, an adviser to Indonesia’s national counter-terrorism agency at a panel discussion in Jakarta on Wednesday.[/FONT][/COLOR]
                          [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial]“We have experience [of those who committed terrorist acts in Indonesia] after going to Afghanistan and the Philippines and we don’t want Isis alumni to do the same.”
                          http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/e2dc2...#axzz3FN0G6fHz [/FONT][/COLOR]
                          "[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Helvetica Neue]I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.[/FONT][/COLOR]"
                          George Bernard Shaw

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                          • #14
                            The thread heading inappropriately, for mine, stresses "the Muslim nation...". The news extract in #8 above shows that other Muslim nations as well as France, Britain etc are struggling with this. Indonesia is not alone in not having been prepared for these events. Australia has only in the last couple of days passed laws allowing effective prevention of "Foreign Fighters" travelling.
                            Last edited by john madden; 07-10-14, 01:38.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by john madden View Post
                              The thread heading inappropriately, for mine, stresses "the Muslim nation...".
                              I did not even know, nor about 25 millions Indonesian knew, that we were a "muslim nation". I thought the thread was about Iran, Pakistan or Mauritania...

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