Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Long overstay (naive [email protected]), seeking advice

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #76
    orry for being a bit late, but here as promised a final report of the experience i had with Immigration at the airport in Jakarta.

    First let me start of by saying that i started this thread with the question: How do i get out the country in a safe and good way?
    In reality the biggest issue turned out to be not how i could get out, but how to prevent my friends/family etc i left behind to not get convicted and punished for mistakes i had made.

    It's not your own problem if you overstay, all your friends, relatives etc are at risk, and even a higher risk than you are yourself by overstaying your visa

    So here's some quick facts:

    I did break the law by overstaying, the punishment is mild, if any at all besides some minor inconvenience and highly likely getting blacklisted.

    My wife did break the law by 'helping out' or even just knowing about my situation and not reporting it to authorities, the punishment for that is severe.

    Keep in mind that the longer you will overstay, the less likely they are willing to accept nobody knew of your situation and/or helped/supported you during your stay, and the harder it gets to
    prove you supported yourself financially and didnt do any payed work in the country.

    The advice asked, and given was aimed at leaving the country, however the whole situation was a bit more complicated than that.

    So exactly what happened?:

    At the day of my planned departure we arrived at the KanIm kelas 1 near Jakarta Airport at 3pm. This was about 9 hours before my flight departed.
    We where let in easy enough and people at that point were friendly but firm.
    Within minutes we were called into a small office where some official listened to our story, honest like i reported it in this thread, but always
    claiming my wife didn't knew and i never informed her about my visa status.
    He asked if i had any tickets and when i presented those he off the bat told me i was not going to make that flight.
    After some calls and a little waiting we were directed to the lobby.

    Just a few minutes later a guy in uniform came sit with us and asked what the problem was, all very friendly.
    I told him i made a mistake and knew i was in trouble, and that i would do anything to fix things and make them right, whatever the consequences.
    At that point he already explained that it could be a big issue, not only for me but especially for my wife and he took me into his office for interrogation, while my wife was left in the lobby waiting.

    In his office again it started out very friendly and understanding, it felt like he was making some idle chitchat, playing the 'good cop', asking general questions about where and how i stayed,
    my income amongst general questions about hobbies, interest, small talk about amsterdam(he'd been there) and girls.
    Then he started asking about my income, i had 2 years (as far as i could print out) of history from my bankaccount, which showed a regular income and withdrawel of amounts in Indonesia.
    When he started asking about my wife and what she knew and did, things started to get a little hostile and the 'bad cop' in him came out.

    I kept telling him she had no real knowledge about my situation, but he didn't want to hear it, and started threatening me with different articles of law which supposedly could send me and my wife to jail
    for multiple years along with some very hefty fines.
    Even though i kept denying, he kept on threatening with jailtime, shoving a translated lawbook under my nose and pointing out the sentences that accompany certain articles, saying that if i didn't
    cooperate he'd advise his boss to charge me with this or that article.
    At a point i made the mistake of asking about an article he showed me, asking if it was the Pasal 78 UU 6/2011 and at that point he totally flipped.

    He accused me of telling him how to do his job, if i thought he didn't know how to do his job and if i felt i was so much better as an indonesian and i should tell them what to do.
    I kept telling him, staying humble all the time, that that was not what i was trying to do, but at that point there wasn't any conversation possible at all anymore.

    He was done with me i said, it was time to call my lawyer and embassy he said and he even offered his phone predialed to me with number of the embassy.

    At this point i knew i could go that way, which probably resulted in a few days detention, loss of my ticket that day and be let off the hook after some inconvenience but what about my wife?
    My wife had still had to undergo interrogation at this point and i feared they could slap the law hard on her.

    I decided to push my luck, saying a don't need a lawyer because i was wrong and i didn't need a lawyer to prove my right, also i said embassy could do nothing for me anyway, and i was sure i could settle this
    by law with himself.
    He had me crawling at that point at it took a lot of apologizing before i could get the conversation going again.
    I kept admitting my guilt, but also kept pointing out that my wife was innocent and we did come out of free will, i could also have just decided to come alone and lie without bringing her.
    Prosecute me to full extend and please leave her alone, because she's innocent, i accept full responsibilities.

    After a tense half hour he started to open up a bit and we got conversation started again.
    We are now about 2 hours interrogation, and my wife is still waiting, however they where still saying i wouldnt fly.

    Then suddenly a few minutes later a collegue came in and told me i could go to my ife in the lobby and tell her she could leave.
    At this point i was very happy with this. I knew i was getting out without too much trouble now, and my wife could go without any accusation.
    At this point a had gladly taken a fe days detention and having to buy a new ticket.

    But my wife (sweet dear that she is) wouldn't go, she wanted to know exactly what was going to happen to me and what they were going to do.
    I stressed her to just go, i'll be allright, but she wouldn't budge.

    So i went back to the office and she went along.
    Here he again started to show my wife what articles of law they could throw at me and how long supposedly they could throw me in jail.
    My wife started freaking out and crying and while i knew we'd get out anyway, she broke under pressure and that guy knew it.

    Then at a point he said listen, he closed the door to the office and asked us to turn off our phones.
    Suddenly he was all compassionate and willing to help, but he had to have some 'incentive' or 'good story' to tell his boss so he would follow his advice of letting us leave.
    We never offered aything but my wife asked what can we do?
    Then he wrote down on a paper: 1500USD

    I told him (emotionally) thank you, but there is no way we could afford such an amount. As long as my wife can go i'm willing to accept thge carges and go to jail if i had to.
    I also told him that the bag i had brought was about everything i still possesed and told him to look again at my bankaccount to see my saldo was already in the minus.
    My wife was already panicking and offering him our phones, offering to ask for money to be payed later etc etc.

    I just kept my position: thank you, but i was wrong, so if i need to be prosecuted and face charges, so be it. It's my own fault.

    I think here he noticed that we couldn't or where unwilling to pay this amount and his attitude changed.
    Can we not declare my wife was pregnant he said? Maybe with such a situation we could get away a lot cheaper and easier.

    My wife immediately agreed with that, and said we'd give anything we had while pulling out her wallet, which at that point contained 1.5juta which she put on the table.

    Of course we had to wait so he could explain our story and offer this amount to his boss.
    When he came back he asked again for my ticket, my passport and explained i was getting deported.
    My wife was allowed to go home.

    I couldn't leave KanIm but we were allowed to wait in the lobby.
    At around 9pm they asked use to go with them for a ride to the airport gate.
    There we had virtually no time for a normal goodbye, i got directed to the checkin counters (even though it was way to early and i told them i already did a online checkin) and so we got seperated.
    When the counter opened i gave my luggage and when i had to go through customs the guy from immigration picked me up and got me through pretty quick and easy.
    Later while i was walking around the tax-free shopping zone on the airport, he and the one who did interrogation looked me up one more time and asked to make a picture of my passports and the
    stamps they had put in it.

    Above story is still short and in a nutshell, but it doesn't show we had a terrible experience and it was very hard, scary and emotional.
    (continued next post due character limit)

    Comment


    • #77
      As conclusion i could say the information and help given on this forum was a major help, there are just a few things i'd personally recommend someone in a similar situation:

      -First of all, know the law (Pasal 78 UU 6/2011) but DO NOT point them to it. Just trust in it, keep calm and let them try to scare you but don't fall for the scare tactics.
      Do not ever mention it but remember that in the end you will be most likely be treated accordingly, whatever they may say at first.

      -DO NOT bring friends/family that might have helped you. This is of course difficulter if you haven't traveled around frequently but if you can avoid bringing in someone, i would go for that.
      If you do bring someone, that person might very well be heavy leverage against you. Even if they didn't help you, they could always force you to prove that and this is difficult to do.

      -You can go on the same day you want to fly, but honestly i think maybe it's better to go a day in advance.
      Sure you will endure detention (at KanIm, not as bad as real jail) but in the end again they will have to abide by the laws, which means you get deported
      If you go alone and early there is no extra leverage they can put on you by threatening family/friends, they have plenty time to sort out your case and there is no pressure of you losing your flight.

      In the end i think i've been let off lightly and yes we payed some bribe.
      We never offered a bribe, and even when asked we tried to get out of it, but in the end it wasn't a bad thing to do so.
      Would i have been alone, i'm sure i would have been deported, maybe a day later and without ever paying any bribes or 'fines' but i had my wife to think about.

      I think that even i couldnt be prosecuted as a heavy criminal, and in the end i would be treated according Pasal 78 UU 6/2011, they could have made things more difficult and delayed so much i
      could have missed the flight.

      I'm also sure it would be fairly easy for them to slap my wife with a lawsuit accuysing her for aiding an illegal alien.

      Again, in the end i feel lucky, and thankful.
      The whole issue should not be taken lightly, it was horrible even more so because it was not only me, but also my wife involved.

      I hope someone reading this will find this post and thread useful, and can use it to solve their situation.

      If something is still unclear or people want to know some specific things, please just ask and i will do my best to reply here.

      Sorry if i missed and didn't reply to previous posts, it's been a few hectic days and it feels like we still are recovering from everything what happened.

      Currently we are busy trying to get my wife to Holland, on a tourist visa and plan things from there.

      Thanks for all the support given in this forum, it has helped me and my wife a lot and probably we'd still be in a bigger mess without it!

      VeggieDutch

      Comment


      • #78
        thank you for the conclusion , good luck for you both .

        Comment


        • #79
          Dear VeggieDutch,

          First of all I would like to thank you for having taken the time to share on the open board the account of your few last hours in Indonesia. It is greatly appreciated.

          I think you have made a few great points and confirmed a few things which have already been said on this board, be in in this thread or in others. There are also a few points that I would like to comment.

          I would like to re-paste a post that I wrote two years ago, following a similar case as yours, and which includes an article of law that I would like to explain:

          Originally posted by atlantis View Post
          So my advise to the OP is as follow:
          • Legally speaking you can keep your IDR 25.000.000, you have no fine/biaya beban to pay to Imigrasi. Now, what you decide to do with it is none of my concern and the board may live without knowing the fact that you used part of it to expedite your case.
          • Be cool and find some VERY good reasons to justify how you've been living here during X years and what you've done. The clearer and trustful your answers would be the shorter your time in detention would be.
          • Be ready to have immigration not very pleased with you and possibly doing as much as they can to convince you that you risk as much as IDR 500.000.000 in fine (see above article 119). You know now what to answer them should they show you this article. Be very smart in the way you contradict them should they point you this article. Show that you know your rights, but don't overdo it. You are the one having infringed the law and even if people love to see Imigrasi as black hearted people, most of the time they are just more incompetent/lacking of legal knowledge than really dishonest. They sure look for a quick buck, but they also have to legally justify their decisions.
          • Don't follow any of the advises telling you to swim to Australia or wherever, to make false reports or provide fake documents. People who advise you this, though certainly genuine and well meaning, are NOT the one at the wrong end of the stick when the sh1t hits the fan. The LAW is what prevails and is what should be investigated first. Once you have this done (see above) you can take an informed decision. Deciding without having done this work first is just stupid and a sure way to hit the wall.
          • I know people who got away of similar situation as yours who did not pay anything and were deported. They are however blacklisted and a return to Indonesia is not a possibility, unless if they apply for a removal of their name on the daftar penangkalan.


          Last, keep in mind that Imigrasi can give troubles to people who have been helping you in the past 6 years. Paradoxally, they may be more at risk than you.

          Pasal 124 UU 6/2011

          Setiap orang yang dengan sengaja menyembunyikan atau melindungi atau memberi pemondokan atau memberikan penghidupan atau memberikan pekerjaan kepada Orang Asing yang diketahui atau patut diduga:
          a. berada di Wilayah Indonesia secara tidak sah dipidana dengan pidana penjara paling lama 2 (dua) tahun dan/atau pidana denda paling banyak Rp200.000.000,00 (dua ratus juta rupiah);
          b. Izin Tinggalnya habis berlaku dipidana dengan pidana kurungan paling lama 3 (tiga) bulan atau pidana denda paling banyak Rp25.000.000,00 (dua puluh lima juta rupiah).

          They risk a fine of up IDR 25.000.000 and a 3 month confinement/pidana kurungan. Here again it is interesting to see the differentiation in between helping an overstayer (point b. 3 month pidana kurungan/administrative confinement) and an imigran gelap (point a. 2 years pidana penjara/jail term). Just be cool with them and stress the point that no indonesian were aware of your (lack of a valid) immigration status.
          Concerning your post, I definitively agree about the below:

          Originally posted by VeggieDutch View Post
          -First of all, know the law (Pasal 78 UU 6/2011) but DO NOT point them to it. Just trust in it, keep calm and let them try to scare you but don't fall for the scare tactics.
          Do not ever mention it but remember that in the end you will be most likely be treated accordingly, whatever they may say at first.
          This is perhaps the most important. Knowing the law, and perhaps even more importantly knowing HOW articles of law are understood and interpreted in court, is where one who have to face the Indonesian legal system should start. If knowing the law is important, avoiding to pique the sensibility and pride of those one has to face is about as important. While your intent may be to have your rights respected, the pejabat facing you may feel that it is an attempt to scorn the authority he has.

          Knowing the above, it would be unwise, especially for a foreigner, to "teach" the law (or even just innocently showing too much that you know exactly how it should be handled) by quoting or naming an article of law to a pejabat which is in charge to enforce it. It would be akin to tell him: "you are wrong, the Indonesian law says...etc".
          This would perhaps be acceptable in an old democracy, but it would simply be a "cultural faux pas" here. In Indonesia, and perhaps also in other part of the World, if you have any kind of authority, you are just seating next to God. This is something to keep in mind when communicating with a pejabat, at any level and for any reason. Deference is expected and playing the game would always bring you benefits, even if it is sometimes hard, especially when you hear ridiculous bullsh1t being uttered.

          Basically, if you have done anything wrong you should try to find out exactly what you risk and let the pejabat trying to put pressure on you or trying to humiliate you. It is important to let him feed his Ego while keeping quite, as much as you can. A bit like you would stand sheltered while rain is pouring. Let him talk, let him believe that he's got a grip and finally let him having the impression that he is magnanimous by "downgrading" the offense you have allegedly committed. They like that, and this is the game they play. At the end of the day, he would have no other choice than sticking to the law and more importantly, how it is interpreted in court if he intends to press any charge.

          In over 15 years here, each time I have been on the edge with a pejabat, it is when I have forgotten the principle stated above. It is when I forgot to remain serene, when I wasn't able to resist to the temptation to pique him/her after hearing ridiculous legal statement, when I have forgotten to just shut up waiting for the rain to end while only giving slight indications that he won't be stepping on my/our rights.

          Many times foreigners are unfortunately oblivious at how important are those unwritten codes concerning authority, social status...etc. It is very different from the "West", but knowing them and how to navigate is primordial, especially in a tough situation such as the one you were in. I really hope that your experience will be of benefit for many in this regard.

          There is a second thing that I would like to discuss here:

          Originally posted by VeggieDutch View Post
          [COLOR=#333333]If you do bring someone, that person might very well be heavy leverage against you.[/COLOR]
          Indeed, it could be an heavy leverage against you. However it would be naive to believe that Imigrasi wouldn't look for this person, in order for example to recoup your version of the story, if you wouldn't come along with him/her. One can decide to come alone, but there is a huge chance that it would just delay one's deportation. They would have looked for your wife, especially considering that it wasn't a three month overstay but one of a few years. They need to JUSTIFY their decision, and it requires that they have at least interviewed people, even if it is not formally. What a pejabat doesn't want is that the decision he is going to take fire back on him later and for this they need to be able to document the fact that they have at least slightly investigated your side of the story.

          Coming along with your wife also gave a human dimension to your story. Let's be honest, pejabat may have pity of a foreigner, but this feeling is far easier to come when they face a foreigner accompanied by an Indonesian spouse.
          It's also important to keep in mind that having a "witness" around who can observe what is going on is an extra guaranty which isn't bad.

          As much as I agree with you that bringing someone with you is an extra leverage on you, don't believe that they wouldn't have looked for this extra leverage. If you wouldn't have come with her, you would have had to lie about the fact that you were married and take the risk that they discover it by themselves. Not a good idea if you want my opinion. They are not all cretins and finding out about it would certainly have taken them only a matter of hours. In the meantime you would have been detained, delaying your deportation and greatly increasing your risks.

          To better understand this "greatly increasing your risks" I would like to remember that the process of a deportation and blacklisting can be long and goes through different administrative steps. At each steps you have a pejabat who has to sign a paper and you take the risk that he can be tempted to check what advantage he may gain in acting as a jackal.

          Allowing them to process your deportation quickly, by coming clean and offering them ways to corroborate your side of the story was definitively the best thing to do imho.
          Last edited by atlantis; 05-02-16, 09:57.

          Comment


          • #80
            Originally posted by VeggieDutch View Post
            My wife did break the law by 'helping out' or even just knowing about my situation and not reporting it to authorities, the punishment for that is severe.
            Originally posted by VeggieDutch View Post
            I'm also sure it would be fairly easy for them to slap my wife with a lawsuit accuysing her for aiding an illegal alien.
            Let me be VERY clear about that and debunk a new urban legend which could pop up. Your wife did NOT "break the law by 'helping out' or even just knowing about (your) situation and not reporting it to authorities" nor it would have been "fairly easy for them to slap (your) wife with a lawsuit accusing her for aiding an illegal alien". No offense intended but these are bullsh1t for anyone knowing the law and researching how the relevant articles of law are interpreted in court.

            [COLOR=#333333]Pasal 124 UU 6/2011 says:[/COLOR]

            Setiap orang yang dengan sengaja menyembunyikan atau melindungi atau memberi pemondokan atau memberikan penghidupan atau memberikan pekerjaan kepada Orang Asing yang diketahui atau patut diduga:
            a. berada di Wilayah Indonesia secara tidak sah dipidana dengan pidana penjara paling lama 2 (dua) tahun dan/atau pidana denda paling banyak Rp200.000.000,00 (dua ratus juta rupiah);
            b. Izin Tinggalnya habis berlaku dipidana dengan pidana kurungan paling lama 3 (tiga) bulan atau pidana denda paling banyak Rp25.000.000,00 (dua puluh lima juta rupiah)
            .

            In all the verbiage above perhaps the most important thing is this bolded part "dengan sengaja". This "dengan sengaja" is a locution which appears in most articles of law and imposes to the judges to review the elements which prove that the accused has infringe the law with FULL knowledge of it and has done it on purpose to gain an obvious advantage. This is well documented in any court decision.

            This notion of "dengan sengaja" must be proven by the cops/prosecutors (and not debunked by you/your wife as a couple of sentence in your post seem to indicate that you believe). If there is no full knowledge and no clear advantage gained by the accused, it is a non case and it would not make it to court.

            The above is corroborated so far in ALL cases where an accused has been charged with article 124 UU 6/2011 since the enactment of the new Immigration Act. A wife of an overstayer being indicted with it? No way.

            Since the enactment of UU 6/2011, this article of law has been used to sue and sentence managers/owners of companies employing illegal foreigners for example. To be more precise, it was against managers/owners of companies who employed not one but several illegal employees with the underlying idea of an important state loss. They (the employers) obviously could not argue that they didn't have full knowledge of the illegal situation of their employees since by law they must receive an employment permit for these foreign workers, and they obviously gained a substantial advantage in helping said illegal foreigners, providing them a salary allowing them to maintain themselves in Indonesia, by avoiding to pay the DPKK (the fee attached to the IMTA).

            The above is a clear example of when and why article 124 UU 6/2011 can be pressed. Again, in the case of your wife, it would have never been used. It would have been laughed out and wouldn't have been accepted by a prosecutor who, in general, have a bit of experience about how the things are viewed in court. There is simply no ground for it.

            Don't get me wrong, I definitively understand that you or your wife may have believed that it was a possibility and I don't underestimate the skills of the pejabat you faced to have you believe so, but it wasn't a legal possibility for them and it is important for readers to get it.

            The difficulty for most is to grab the difference in between how an article is written and what each notion it refers to is interpreted in court.

            To give another example among hundreds one could find while reading this forum, I would like to quote a paragraph of my above post:

            [COLOR=#333333]In Indonesia, and perhaps also in other part of the World, if you have any kind of authority, you are just seating next to God. This is something to keep in mind when communicating with a pejabat, at any level and for any reason. Deference is expected and playing the game would always bring you benefits, even if it is sometimes hard, especially when you hear ridiculous bullsh1t being uttered.[/COLOR]
            [COLOR=#333333]

            One could say: "Woow... atlantis has shown contempt to the government of Indonesia and some of its pejabat" by saying that Pejabat may utter ridiculous bullsh1t and that they feel they are sitting next to God. By doing so he has broken the law (cf chapter V KUHP and, why not, the blasphemy law if one is tortuous enough to believe it would work) and it should be [/COLOR]fairly easy to slap him with a lawsuit accusing him of it.
            If you read chapter V of the Indonesian Penal code, you may come with this conclusion. However, the reality of Indonesian court is VERY different.
            Last edited by atlantis; 05-02-16, 09:47.

            Comment


            • #81
              Originally posted by atlantis View Post
              Let me be VERY clear about that and debunk a new urban legend which could pop up. Your wife did NOT "break the law by 'helping out' or even just knowing about (your) situation and not reporting it to authorities" nor it would have been "fairly easy for them to slap (your) wife with a lawsuit accusing her for aiding an illegal alien". No offense intended but these are bullsh1t for anyone knowing the law and researching how the relevant articles of law are interpreted in court.

              [COLOR=#333333]Pasal 124 UU 6/2011 says:[/COLOR]

              Setiap orang yang dengan sengaja menyembunyikan atau melindungi atau memberi pemondokan atau memberikan penghidupan atau memberikan pekerjaan kepada Orang Asing yang diketahui atau patut diduga:
              a. berada di Wilayah Indonesia secara tidak sah dipidana dengan pidana penjara paling lama 2 (dua) tahun dan/atau pidana denda paling banyak Rp200.000.000,00 (dua ratus juta rupiah);
              b. Izin Tinggalnya habis berlaku dipidana dengan pidana kurungan paling lama 3 (tiga) bulan atau pidana denda paling banyak Rp25.000.000,00 (dua puluh lima juta rupiah)
              .

              In all the verbiage above perhaps the most important thing is this bolded part "dengan sengaja". This "dengan sengaja" is a locution which appears in most articles of law and imposes to the judges to review the elements which prove that the accused has infringe the law with FULL knowledge of it and has done it on purpose to gain an obvious advantage. This is well documented in any court decision.

              This notion of "dengan sengaja" must be proven by the cops/prosecutors (and not debunked by you/your wife as a couple of sentence in your post seem to indicate that you believe). If there is no full knowledge and no clear advantage gained by the accused, it is a non case and it would not make it to court.

              The above is corroborated so far in ALL cases where an accused has been charged with article 124 UU 6/2011 since the enactment of the new Immigration Act. A wife of an overstayer being indicted with it? No way.
              As much as this is super insightful, if I may question a part of Bapak Atlantis post (who, in this forum, seats at the feet of the Divine),
              [COLOR=#333333]Pasal 124 UU 6/2011 says:[/COLOR]
              Setiap orang yang dengan sengaja menyembunyikan atau
              Putting the knowledge of the person's immigration status aside, I understand that sengaja is defined as deliberate. As in with intent to help as opposed to helped indirectly or without intent to help them specifically evade detection. Your explanation says the burden to prove knowledge of it AND gain advantage. I question the second part where the burden of proof to show actual gain/advantage is necessary. I would think it collaborates and makes it harder to refute but would not be a requirement for the decision if they were breaking said law.

              Every person that deliberately(!) (hide, shelter, other such actions) to the accused foreigner that are known to or suspected of....

              Comment


              • #82
                Hi

                First I want to say thanks for posting this information. It's actually just what im looking for.

                May situation is similar. Im a Canadian living in Lombok, Indonesia. I'm married to a women from Lombok and we have a son who is over a year old. At the time of our marriage, my visa was still good as I had extended my visa on arrival. So we have the buku nikah and all the legitimate documents.

                But since then I have overstayed my visa, due to lack of income to afford me leaving the country. It's been now almost two years, as my overstay began at the end of January 2015. I know I've broken the law and so does my wife and her family, but we just haven't done anything because we know that with little money the situation is hard to solve.

                What we really want is to go to Canada where im from, and I want to bring my wife and son along as well. And as soon as we get the money to buy the tickets (most likely from my family back home) that's what we plan to do. But I've been worried about my overstay and how that will go about at the airport. After reading this post, it relieves me to know that I just have to go to the airport when i'm ready to depart. But i'm still a little worried.

                I don't know when I'll have the tickets ready, It could be another few months or longer, depending on when my family can afford to help out. In terms of my income for the last two years its the same as VeggieDutch, biweekly money has been sent to my account mostly from my family back home to help with necessities, and I could print out my bank statements as well.

                Please any advice on what I should be doing now, and what my next step should be. We just finished making my wife's passport.

                Thanks for your time.

                Comment


                • #83
                  VeggieDutch's case in this thread is the best example I saw in this Forum .

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    do NOT gp to the imigrasi or else ull be deported for 1 or 2 years bro
                    if you want a good solution inbox me i have some one who can help u in this issue

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      We've just updated this article with some new information from a recent expat's experience - overstaying due to medical reasons. Fortunately for him - it was less than 60 days !
                      http://upload.expat.or.id/info/overstayingyourvisa.html
                      Danielle Surkatty
                      Member of the Organizing Committee
                      Living in Indonesia, A Site for Expatriates
                      http://www.expat.or.id/

                      Living in Indonesia Expat Forum
                      http://www.livinginindonesiaforum.org/
                      [email protected]

                      Comment

                      Working...
                      X