View Full Version : Visas are confusing :(
I'm an Indonesian, who is married to an American. My 2 year old daughter now has both passports. I have a million questions:
We're planning on staying (forever) in Indonesia as of May of next year. However, I don't want my husband nor my daughter to lose their US citizenships. What kind of visa would you recommend them to have (without having to leave the country)?
If it is Kitas/Kitap, can I (or anyone in my Indonesian family) be the sponsor instead of a company? And does my husband has to have a job?
Also, is Kitas/Kitap extendable?
on a separate case....
Which passport should my daughter use?
If she uses the Indonesian one: will they give her trouble in the American outgoing port?
If she uses the American one: will they give her trouble in the Indonesian incoming port?
And if there are any other details I haven't asked, pls feel free to explain the full detail to me as my brain is about to explode :(
I'm an Indonesian, who is married to an American. My 2 year old daughter now has both passports. I have a million questions:
We're planning on staying (forever) in Indonesia as of May of next year. However, I don't want my husband nor my daughter to lose their US citizenships. What kind of visa would you recommend them to have (without having to leave the country)?
If it is Kitas/Kitap, can I (or anyone in my Indonesian family) be the sponsor instead of a company? And does my husband has to have a job?
Also, is Kitas/Kitap extendable?
on a separate case....
Which passport should my daughter use?
If she uses the Indonesian one: will they give her trouble in the American outgoing port?
If she uses the American one: will they give her trouble in the Indonesian incoming port?
And if there are any other details I haven't asked, pls feel free to explain the full detail to me as my brain is about to explode :(
About your kid:
If she holds two citizenship as per law 12 tahun 2006 and two passports, then no problem. She will have to show the two passport to the US customs, the US one to show that she stayed legally in the US and the Indonesian one to show them that she won't need a visa. She will then have to enter Indonesia showing her Indonesian passport and won't need a visa. Make sure you keep handy her US passport. Indonesian immigration officer may require to see it. You daughter is fully Indonesian while staying in Indonesia. No hassle. As long as US allows (and they do) double citizenship, he/she won't loose his/her US citizenship while staying in Indonesia. However, under Indonesian law, when she would reach 18 years old, or when she would marry, whatever comes first, your daughter will have to choose what citizenship she wants to keep. She will have three years to make this choice (until she reaches 21 yo). By then, the Indonesian law would have certainly changed and you will have to update this.
What kind of visa would you recommend them to have (without having to leave the country)?
If it is Kitas/Kitap, can I (or anyone in my Indonesian family) be the sponsor instead of a company? And does my husband has to have a job?
Also, is Kitas/Kitap extendable?
And if there are any other details I haven't asked, pls feel free to explain the full detail to me as my brain is about to explode :(
About your husband:
I would advice the following procedure:
Before departing, go to the KBRI and ask for him a sosial budaya visa. Procedure is easy and simple. To apply, just prepare the following:
- a letter of sponsor inwhich you will have to invite your husband to stay in Indonesia. Very simple to sort out. I can provide you some basic samples.
- a photocopy of your KTP/paspor RI
- a photocopy of your Buku Nikah (islam) or Akte Perkawinan (kristen) - not really mandatory.
- a copy of his airline ticket (return trip)
- his passport
- usually a couple of pics
- fill the furmular that the KBRI will provide you in the States
- pay the visa fee (usually around 45 USD
They will then issue a visa valid for 60 days. After 60 days, if he still want to stay longer, you will have to apply, along with him for a first visa extension. Visa extension are granted for 30 days each. You can extend your sosial budaya visa up to 4 times for a total maximum stay of 180 days. But after the second extension (ie his 4th months of stay)*, you will have to request to process a KITAS for him as per law 12 tahun 2006. The important thing is that he doesn't have to go out of the country during his first 6 months of stay in Indonesia. It would void the procedure and he would have to make a new sosbud to start again. After the 6th month of stay (ie the end of the 4th extension of the sosbud visa), your husband will be issued a KITAS, first for 6 months or 1 year (depending on the validity of his passport). After this, he will be allowed to extend it on yearly basis without having to leave the country.
You will be the sponsor of the KITAS and it will allow him to stay for a full year in Indonesia.
Concerning his US citizenship, no problem, as long as he doesn't intend to become indonesian.
Do not hesitate to PM me if you need the various text of law regulating the visa procedure. Same if you do need advice while doing the paperworks. Make it easy for yourself, follow the procedure, stick to the law and don't indulge yourself into corrupting or bribing immigration officers. As an Indonesian wife married to a foreign husband you have Rights and they must respect them.
* the rule of applying for the KITAS after the 4th month of stay seem to be subject to local interpretations. Law says that you must wait minimum 4 months before starting the procedure, but I recently had report (from Bali) that Imigrasi "could" process the transformation of a VSKB (sosbud) into a KITAS before, though I don't have any proof of it. Until now, I only knew and heard about the 4 months rule. Better to check directly with them as soon as you enter the country. Why would you want to wait if it could be processed quicker legally.
Last but not least, if you and your family stay in a private house, you (or the person who gives shelter) will have to go to the nearest Polsek/Polda to register your husband (your daughter, being Indonesian, does not need to be registered) to the POA (Pengawasan Orang Asing) department. Bring his passport and your KTP/passport RI and they will issue a paper called STM (Surat Tanda Melapor). You won't have to register him again before the end of his Sosbud, but you will have to do it again when he will have his KITAS. They will then issue him a SKLD (Surat Keterangan Lapor Diri), which is a plastic card which has the size of a credit card (they will request a few pics and he will have his fingerprint taken).
None of the above has a legal fee, though I heard that there may have a "biaya resmi" to be paid to Mabes Polri of IDR 50.000 for the SKLD, and I advice you to stick to it even if they claim that there is a fee. However tipping is not a crime as long as it is a will and that you are not forced to. I know one korean guy who gave away 1 million rupiah every year for this stupid card and who complains that police officers were queueing at his door with various demands ! You just need to do these registrations and you have 24 hours to do so after he starts to be sheltered.
Hope you guys will enjoy your stay in Indonesia.
Being the sponsor of his KITAS, your husband won't need and won't be allow to work. Just make sure you keep some bank statement showing than you can assume him financially. Imigrasi could ask you to prove than you have enough money to do so. If one day your husband intends to work, he will then have to get a new KITAS sponsored by the company who plans to employ him.
Wow, oxusere, you are so lucky to have Atlantis explain all this to you. In fact I'm going to copy and paste this complete explanation in my file as it's clear and so comprehensive but easy to understand and follow. I'd need this for my husband once we move in a 2 years time.
Thank you very much, Atlantis.
how do I put this??? you are a SAVIOR!!! thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow, oxusere, you are so lucky to have Atlantis explain all this to you. In fact I'm going to copy and paste this complete explanation in my file as it's clear and so comprehensive but easy to understand and follow. I'd need this for my husband once we move in a 2 years time.
Thank you very much, Atlantis.
You are welcome. Just keep mind that the regulation may slightly change in two years from now. I will PM you an email where you can contact me if you do need more infos by then.
how do I put this??? you are a SAVIOR!!! thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow! :o:o:o
Thanks anyways. ;)
I actually have one more question.
As a sponsor, will I only need a bank statement showing that I have enough to support my husband? or will I need a proof of employment? (bc I'm not planning to work either). My husband is a veteran, and he gets money every month from the gov, and that's what we're planning to live on. Thx!!!
I actually have one more question.
As a sponsor, will I only need a bank statement showing that I have enough to support my husband? or will I need a proof of employment? (bc I'm not planning to work either). My husband is a veteran, and he gets money every month from the gov, and that's what we're planning to live on. Thx!!!
Bank statement only, if requested. I will PM you soon some advice about it. As soon as your husband will get his KITAS, open a bank account under his name and get the money transfered monthly. Keep the receipt and show them upon request. I do not think they will bother you about that. You just need to be able to prove that both of you are financially safe.
(...)my brain is about to explode :(
Check your email. You will find the 8 Undang2 or Peraturan2 that you may need to know to navigate through it. Take it easy, step by step as I described it previously. No difficulties should arise. If needed email me.;)
Being the sponsor of his KITAS, your husband won't need and won't be allow to work. Just make sure you keep some bank statement showing than you can assume him financially. Imigrasi could ask you to prove than you have enough money to do so. If one day your husband intends to work, he will then have to get a new KITAS sponsored by the company who plans to employ him.
Hi Atlantis,
I'm busting in on this conversation...My wife is Indo citizen and we'd like to move to Indo eventually. How much money does the law require to show on a bank statement in order to live there?
Thanks. this is my first post so i hope i did it correctly.
Hi Atlantis,
I'm busting in on this conversation...My wife is Indo citizen and we'd like to move to Indo eventually. How much money does the law require to show on a bank statement in order to live there?
Thanks. this is my first post so i hope i did it correctly.
1. Peraturan Pemerintah nomor 32 tahun 1994 says :
BAGIAN KELIMA
TATA CARA PERMINTAAN, PEMBERIAN ATAU
PENOLAKAN PEMBERIAN VISA
Pasal 14
(2) Permintaan Visa sebagaimana dimaksud dalam ayat (1) dajukan dengan melampirkan :
a. paspor
b. tiket untuk keberangkatan dan tiket untuk kembali, atau tiket untuk
melanjutkan perjalanan ke negara tujuan;
c. pas photo; dan
d. keterangan jaminan tersedianya biaya hidup selama berada di wilayah Negara Republik Indonesia.
No indication of amount:(. You just have to prove, if required, that you have enough money to live in Indonesia for the amount of time that you plan to stay. To my opinion, a bank statement showing a positive balance of an amount equivalent to 5 to 10 millions rupiah per month of stay should be more than enough! It could even be less than that (some Indonesian have to make it with an income way below 1 million per month and a family to take care of - how could immigration argue that you can not make it with, say, 3 or 5 millions per month?).
2. Welcome to Indonesia... and to the forum. I hope that I've answered in a suitable manner to your first post ;) Do not hesitate to ask more questions.
TO BLAKEN: Corruption, at this level, is more a psychological game than anything else. Immigration officers act in a rude manner towards us, trying to put us in an unconfortable situation, trying to make us (or our wife) feel that we are guilty of something... just to get some extra money from us.
If they see that you know your rights, they won't annoy you long. In 2006, a new law has been voted giving much more rights to Indonesian women married with foreigners and forcing Immigration officers to be more soft in handling this situation. If you have any serious trouble with an immigration officer, and that you feel that they mess with the law, just warn them that you will have to report to the Kantor Wilayah and/or to the DirJen Imigrasi.
Feel free to contact me at anytime if you need advice about any situation involving Imigrasi... I have a particular crush with them ;)
No bank statement is necessary, just a letter from the sponsor stating that they will be responsible for any financial matters
No bank statement or pay slip officially requested by the law, I agree. But as usually there is "teori" and "praktek". I stayed 5 years on a sosbud visa, continously renewed. Each times I applied for a visa extension, I gave a written proof that I was living on money from overseas. Before that I start to do that, Imigrasi was keen on giving me headaches about illegal working. As soon as I started to provide a bank statement showing that I was transferring funds from abroad every year, the "illegal working hassles" dropped. Immigration officers are just trying to get some extra money and will often try to find "mistakes" where there is none, or will try to interpret the law in silly ways. I would advice to any foreigner to answer the possible questions before that they get asked. In other terms, close the doors to any attempts that Immigration would make to ask you illegal money.
Hence the bank statement advice.
On top of that the law that I cited has been implemented by different Kepusan Menteri giving to the immigration officer the right and the power to ask to prove with what type of money you live in Indonesia. This is one of several response to check and fight illegal working. Even if the sponsor sign a "surat jaminan", it can be considered not enough and your izin could be refused.
Please, note that I edited my post #3, concerning VSKB (SosBud) transformed in KITAS, and completed it. If you were concerned by this post, and took informations from it, make sure you re-read it. Thanks. :)
This is specially true for Osuxere, April and Bingo.
elisheva.d
16-09-08, 19:02
Before departing, go to the KBRI and ask for him a sosial budaya visa. Procedure is easy and simple. To apply, just prepare the following:
- a letter of sponsor inwhich you will have to invite your husband to stay in Indonesia. Very simple to sort out. I can provide you some basic samples.
- a photocopy of your KTP/paspor RI
- a photocopy of your Buku Nikah (islam) or Akte Perkawinan (kristen) - not really mandatory.
- a copy of his airline ticket (return trip)
- his passport
- usually a couple of pics
- fill the furmular that the KBRI will provide you in the States
- pay the visa fee (usually around 45 USD
Does the sponsor not have to provide a copy of her bank account statement for the sosbud visa?
http://www.bali-expat-business.com/indonesia-visa.php?p=6
(http://www.bali-expat-business.com/indonesia-visa.php?p=6)
Does the sponsor not have to provide a copy of her bank account statement for the sosbud visa?
http://www.bali-expat-business.com/indonesia-visa.php?p=6
(http://www.bali-expat-business.com/indonesia-visa.php?p=6)
KBRI won't ask it in order to deliver the visa abroad. I have never heard about it and anyway, this is not mandatory by law. For visa extension (izin perpanjagan) it is not mandatory by law either, but I would strongly advice you do join one. It is just a strategy. You eliminate one of their favorite trick to get some extra money by doing so. If they threaten you to refuse the extension, just keep cool and ask them to provide you a Surat Keterangan Penolakan stating the reason why they want to refuse the extension. They cannot refuse to remit you this paper. If they refuse to comply with the law, just go to the KanWil and complain. As long as your friend do nothing wrong, it should be OK. If you go need to complain I will provide you all the text of law that you may need to get your right of sponsorship respected.
Respect the procedure, by applying 7 days minimum before the end of the visa/extension, be courteous but firm and provide all the requested document and you will do fine without having to bother with bribes.
elisheva.d
16-09-08, 20:25
KBRI won't ask it in order to deliver the visa abroad. I have never heard about it and anyway, this is not mandatory by law. For visa extension (izin perpanjagan) it is not mandatory by law either, but I would strongly advice you do join one. It is just a strategy. You eliminate one of their favorite trick to get some extra money by doing so. If they threaten you to refuse the extension, just keep cool and ask them to provide you a Surat Keterangan Penolakan stating the reason why they want to refuse the extension. They cannot refuse to remit you this paper. If they refuse to comply with the law, just go to the KanWil and complain. As long as your friend do nothing wrong, it should be OK. If you go need to complain I will provide you all the text of law that you may need to get your right of sponsorship respected.
Respect the procedure, by applying 7 days minimum before the end of the visa/extension, be courteous but firm and provide all the requested document and you will do fine without having to bother with bribes.
Wow... thanks a lot for the explanation! :)
You should be a lawyer for all this immigration thingy....
Wow... thanks a lot for the explanation! :)
You should be a lawyer for all this immigration thingy....
When I first arrive in Indonesia 7 years ago, I got in too many headaches with imigrasi. No informations to be found, too far away from Jakarta to complain, very restrictive and xenophobic immigration law (before 2006). Little by little I gained experience and knowledge. Time for me to payback and help...
If in need, don't hesitate. There is no stupid questions.:)
Hi Atlantis, nice to meet you, thanks for your reply for my PM about the visa for my boyfriend. It is very confusing.
I didn't know anything about KITAS and everything I hope you can help him though, very very thank you in advance :)
Anyway, I heard that fiskal thing will be remove from the system next year, is it also be effect for the KITAS holder too?
All respect :)
Hi Atlantis, nice to meet you, thanks for your reply for my PM about the visa for my boyfriend. It is very confusing.
I didn't know anything about KITAS and everything I hope you can help him though, very very thank you in advance :)
Anyway, I heard that fiskal thing will be remove from the system next year, is it also be effect for the KITAS holder too?
All respect :)
I received an email from your friend. I will try my best to answer as soon as I can. I am a bit busy at the moment (just got a baby girl:)) but I keep it in mind.
About Fiskal, there is 7 years that I hear they will stop this very soon... Last report I heard it would be done by 2010... May be yes, maybe not ;)
I received an email from your friend. I will try my best to answer as soon as I can. I am a bit busy at the moment (just got a baby girl:)) but I keep it in mind.
About Fiskal, there is 7 years that I hear they will stop this very soon... Last report I heard it would be done by 2010... May be yes, maybe not ;)
Wow congratulation for you and your wife Atlantis! I hope everything is well with your new angel and her mom :)
TO BLAKEN: Corruption, at this level, is more a psychological game than anything else. Immigration officers act in a rude manner towards us, trying to put us in an unconfortable situation, trying to make us (or our wife) feel that we are guilty of something... just to get some extra money from us.
If they see that you know your rights, they won't annoy you long. In 2006, a new law has been voted giving much more rights to Indonesian women married with foreigners and forcing Immigration officers to be more soft in handling this situation. If you have any serious trouble with an immigration officer, and that you feel that they mess with the law, just warn them that you will have to report to the Kantor Wilayah and/or to the DirJen Imigrasi.
Feel free to contact me at anytime if you need advice about any situation involving Imigrasi... I have a particular crush with them ;)
Thanks so much for the help! I'm sure i'll be back with more questions.
If you are here on a business visa, can you apply for any KITAS card here in Indonesia?? Cheers.
If you are here on a business visa, can you apply for any KITAS card here in Indonesia?? Cheers.
This is two different visas that you are talking about. However, you can transform a Visa Kunjungan Usaha (business visa) in a KITAS, as long as you fill all the requirements to get a KITAS. If you give mor details about your personal status/situation, I could give you a more precise answer.
Hi I am a Canadian Married to an Indonesian wife. Last month we were in Bali and asked about Kitas they said it was not possible at all with a man under the age of 55. Now I read this and see some hope. Currently I am on a visa run in Singapore and i would like this to be my last one. What do i need to do to transform my visa? I understand I will need to be in Indonesia for 4 months and do 2 extensions. But after that how do i start the KItas proses. I am currently living in SULSEL and we have an imigrasi office in Pare-Pare but i don;t know what services they provide. THank you so much for all your help
Hi I am a Canadian Married to an Indonesian wife. Last month we were in Bali and asked about Kitas they said it was not possible at all with a man under the age of 55. Now I read this and see some hope. Currently I am on a visa run in Singapore and i would like this to be my last one. What do i need to do to transform my visa? I understand I will need to be in Indonesia for 4 months and do 2 extensions. But after that how do i start the KItas proses. I am currently living in SULSEL and we have an imigrasi office in Pare-Pare but i don;t know what services they provide. THank you so much for all your help
Hi,
I wrote a thread about transforming a SosBud in a Kitas in the Law channel. read it and it should give you some infos about how to do it. Unfortunately I am out of Indonesia and busy until the end of January and can not be of any help. However, when I'll be back, don't hesitate to PM me so that I forward you the texts of law that you need to show to the immigration office in Pare Pare if they do not know how to handle your request.
Make sure you enter Indonesia on a sosbud. A sosbud can be transformed in a KITAS sponsored by your wife, but a vsa kunjugan wisata or a VoA can not be transformed.
The people who told you that you can not get a KITAS sponsored by your wife if you aren't 55 y.o just don't know what they are talking about. If you are legally married to an Indonesian citizen, you can be sponsored by your wife to have a temporary residenc permit (KITAS) valid for 1 yar and extendable This possibility has been given by the citizenship law of 2006 and started to be implemented in 2007.
How about me? I will enter indonesia in March 2009 but im not married yet. I will be married in indonesia within a month. Can i still enter on a sosbud and later change it to kitas solong as i marry within the first months?
How about me? I will enter indonesia in March 2009 but im not married yet. I will be married in indonesia within a month. Can i still enter on a sosbud and later change it to kitas solong as i marry within the first months?
As long as you manage to have all the documents requested before the end of the sosbud, you should be able to do it.
Ahh thanks, and another thing that im not sure of just yet coz i havent spoken to my travel agent. When i enter indo on a sosbud do i need to show a return ticket to my home country even its not my intension to return home? Im trying to save wherever i can so buying a one way ticket will be a big help. Once again thanks for your help
Ahh thanks, and another thing that im not sure of just yet coz i havent spoken to my travel agent. When i enter indo on a sosbud do i need to show a return ticket to my home country even its not my intension to return home? Im trying to save wherever i can so buying a one way ticket will be a big help. Once again thanks for your help
By law you are requested to have a return or an onward ticket to the next country if you plan to enter indonesia. You do not need a return ticket to your home country. Any other country is enough. This is the law, but this regulation is mainly enforced by the airlines companies rather than by the immigration officers at your port of entrance. Airlines companies may refuse to let you board a plane if you are unable to provide them with a return or an onward ticket. A boat ticket from Batam to Singapore would be enough. Nothing says that you need an air-ticket. It could even be a bus ticket Kalimantan/Orient. Malaysia or to TimTim for example if you could find one.
I have been travelling in and out indonesia for years just with a boat ticket to show and never had a problem.
Hi Atlantis,
I know this is from awhile back but i want to ask :
If she (the child) holds two citizenship as per law 12 tahun 2006 and two passports, then no problem.
I understand that children born after 2006 has the law on their side as they can choose to be Indonesian citizen at the ripe age of 18y.old.
but what about those that were born before 2006.
lots of families opt for birth certificate luar nikah and if the kid's birth certificate is not luar nikah they have to use kitas in order to stay with indonesian mom? that's such a harsh reality isn't it? like a slap on the face? seems like we have no rights at all?
am i right? can you clarify?
About your kid:
If she holds two citizenship as per law 12 tahun 2006 and two passports, then no problem. She will have to show the two passport to the US customs, the US one to show that she stayed legally in the US and the Indonesian one to show them that she won't need a visa. She will then have to enter Indonesia showing her Indonesian passport and won't need a visa. Make sure you keep handy her US passport. Indonesian immigration officer may require to see it. You daughter is fully Indonesian while staying in Indonesia. No hassle. As long as US allows (and they do) double citizenship, he/she won't loose his/her US citizenship while staying in Indonesia. However, under Indonesian law, when she would reach 18 years old, or when she would marry, whatever comes first, your daughter will have to choose what citizenship she wants to keep. She will have three years to make this choice (until she reaches 21 yo). By then, the Indonesian law would have certainly changed and you will have to update this.
Happy_mom,
Your perception of how the law now is wrong.
I have a kid born in October 2003 and a kid born in October 2008. I married my indonesian wife in July 2003. At the time my first kid born the prevailing law concerning citizenship was the Undang Undang nomor 62 tahun 1958 tentang kewarganegaraan RI which was a real pain in the bum for mixed married couple. If the father was WNA (http://www.livinginindonesiaforum.org/showthread.php/2539-Abbreviations-Acronyms-and-their-meaning?p=21564&viewfull=1#post21564), the kid born form the marriage was automatically considered as of the citizenship and could not have indonesian citizenship even if his/her mother was WNI (http://www.livinginindonesiaforum.org/showthread.php/2539-Abbreviations-Acronyms-and-their-meaning?p=21564&viewfull=1#post21564).
When my first kid born I had to arrange a KITAS for him to stay in Indonesia, even if he was born in Manado and even if his mother was indonesian. That was the rule for the like of us.
August 1st 2006 has seen a drastic change with the enactment of UU 12 tahun 2006 tentang kewarganegaraan RI. This law abrogated the old silly UU 62/1958 and kids born from a mixed couple are now entitled to be automatically indonesian citizenship, even if their father are WNA. My daughter born in October 2008 had this chance (though I had to fight with the CaPil when I had her akta kelahiran issued) and I didn't have to do much for her to get an indonesian passport.
For kids born before august 1st 2006, like my son, they had 4 years to apply for Indonesian citizenship. That's what I did and my son became indonesian citizen in March 2007, concurrently with his french citizenship. The process for those kids to be naturalized was not that smooth. Even if I personally didn't have much troubles (anyway I wasn't in the mood of letting anyone messing with his rights) I know quite a few parents who got a few headaches.
Both of my kids now are dual citizen, indonesian & french. Both of them have the right to remain dual citizen until they reach the age of 18. They will have then 3 years to take a decision and retain only one citizenship.
In order to simplify our life when we travel to France, we travel only with their Indonesian passport. France issues them a free Schengen visa, valid 5 years for multiple entry. It means that when they are in France, they enter as Indonesian, even if they also have french citizenship. That's our choice. Anyway, they also have a french passport... which is kept at the bank in our SDB. traveling with 2 passports is a bit of an headache.
Many parents did the choice of having their kid(s) luar nikah, prior to the new citizenship law. I think it was a mistake due to misinformation. I didn't want my kid to be out of wedlock which, if you stay in Indonesia, isn't always an easy situation. Obtaining a KITAS for my son, in between 2003 and 2007 has never been an headache and was costing me only IDR 400.000 / year; well I obviously had to kick a few corrupted asses but I can't say that it has been an headache.
My son never really realised what all the fuse was about and what having indonesian citizenship was meaning at this time. He's received his SK kewarganegaraan from Bpk Andi Matalatta the then Minister of Justice and Human Rights who came to Manado for a visit. My son, who was 3 years old, received his SK from the Minister in a reception given for those mixed blood kids and told him in manadonese "Makase. Pak Menteri memang orang bae ada kase "surat kado" pa Theo" while shaking his hand. Andi Matalatta who is makasarese obviously understood. My son thought it was a gift like a birthday or Santa Klaus gift. Nice souvenir.
I hope it clarifies things. If it doesn't feel free to add more questions.
Thanks Atlantis. This info is precious. Particularly for the like of me who has no clue of the law. Having spend my days reading your threads and posts. I can't believe they make such a discrimination on mixed married couples.
I wonder though why it had to be just four years in order to report for naturalization?any idea? "For kids born before august 1st 2006, like my son, they had 4 years to apply for Indonesian citizenship"
Hubby had working Kitas in the year 2000 was a real hell back then. Had visits from Depnaker people and Immigration people to our office, about four times a year. Although we have all the permit papers they always seemed to be able to bully us. Lots of nightmare stories and no real info like this were ever available back then.
I had no real regrets of making my kid's birth cert luar nikah though as a woman they always see me with "the funny look" . A mother has to do whatever necessary to protect her brood. Though it may not be the best way out. That was the only way out at the time. At least that's the only way that we knew at the time.
Happy_mom,
Your perception of how the law is now is wrong.
I have a kid born in October 2003 and a kid born in October 2008. I married my indonesian wife in July 2003. At the time my first kid born the prevailing law concerning citizenship was the Undang Undang nomor 62 tahun 1958 tentang kewarganegaraan RI which was a real pain in the bum for mixed married couple. If the father was WNA (http://www.livinginindonesiaforum.org/showthread.php/2539-Abbreviations-Acronyms-and-their-meaning?p=21564&viewfull=1#post21564), the kid born form the marriage was automatically considered as of the citizenship and could not have indonesian citizenship even if his/her mother was WNI (http://www.livinginindonesiaforum.org/showthread.php/2539-Abbreviations-Acronyms-and-their-meaning?p=21564&viewfull=1#post21564).
When my first kid born I had to arrange a KITAS for him to stay in Indonesia, even if he was born in Manado and even if his mother was indonesian. That was the rule for the like of us.
August 1st 2006 has seen a drastic change with the enactment of UU 12 tahun 2006 tentang kewarganegaraan RI. This law abrogated the old silly UU 62/1958 and kids born from a mixed couple are now entitled to be automatically indonesian citizenship, even if their father are WNA. My daughter born in October 2008 had this chance (though I had to fight with the CaPil when I had her akta kelahiran issued) and I didn't have to do much for her to get an indonesian passport.
For kids born before august 1st 2006, like my son, they had 4 years to apply for Indonesian citizenship. That's what I did and my son became indonesian citizen in March 2007, concurrently with his french citizenship. The process for those kids to be naturalized was not that smooth. Even if I personally didn't have much troubles (anyway I wasn't in the mood of letting anyone messing with his rights) I know quite a few parents who got a few headaches).
Both of my kids now are dual citizen, indonesian & fernch. Both of them have the right to remain dual citizen until they reach the age of 18. They will have then 3 years to take a decision and retain only one citizenship.
In order to simplify our life when we travel to France, we travel only with their Indonesian passport. France issues them a free Schengen visa, valid 5 years for multiple entry. It means that when they are in France, they enter as Indonesian, even if they also have french citizenship. That's our choice. Anyway, they also have a french passport... which is kept at the bank in our SDB. traveling with 2 passports is a bit of an headache.
Many parents did the choice of having their kid(s) luar nikah, prior to the new citizenship law. I think it was a mistake due to misinformation. I didn't want my kid to be out of wedlock which, if you stay in Indonesia, isn't always an easy situation. Obtaining a KITAS for my son, in between 2003 and 2007 has never been an headache and was costing me only IDR 400.000 / year; well I obviously had to kick a few corrupted asses but I can't say that it has been an headache.
My son never really realised what all the fuse was about and what having indonesian citizenship was meaning at this time. He's received his SK kewarganegaraan from Bpk Andi Matalatta the then Minister of Justice and Human Rights who came to Manado for a visit. My son, who was 3 years old, received his SK from the Minister in a reception given for those mixed blood kids and told him in manadonese "Makase. Pak Menteri memang orang bae ada kase "surat kado" pa Theo" while shaking his hand. Andi Matalatta who is makassarese obviously understood. My son thought it was a gift like a birthday or Santa Klaus gift. Nice souvenir.
I hope it clarifies things. If it doesn't feel free to add more questions.
I wonder though why it had to be just four years in order to report for naturalization?any idea?
I don't explain it by anything else than stupid nationalism to appeal to the most conservative fractions of the DPR. Sounds like "Let's grant those foreigners dual citizenship but let's make it hard enough so that a few stay out of the process". Indeed, at the beginning, some pejabat acted like if it was an exceptionnal favor to these kids!!!
mariloustique
29-11-12, 10:35
I'm sooooo glad to hear I'm not the only one the petugas are giving a hard time to :) I'm off to Penang in two weeks from now and will probably ask you for advice upon return !
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