View Full Version : Affordable national plus at jakarta
Hello everybody, I found this forum while searching info about children education in Jakarta.
I am from Madrid (Spain) and I have been offered a job in Jakarta so I am reading all I can about the city, expat life, etc.
My biggest concern is about the education for my 8 years old child. He doesn't speak english at all so it is not going to be admitted in any international school. Apart from that, I can not really afford the International Schools fees.
So, can you please recommend me any affordable national plus school in Jakarta? It is OK for me if the teachers are indonesian. For sure they are going to have better english than my son!
My idea is to bring along with me spanish teaching books and follow the spanish curriculum at home while he attends school in Jakarta. This way he will learn english, bahasa indonesia, will socialize with other children but as well he will stay in touch with thel spanish subjects.
My future work will be in the Sudirman area. Any suggestion which area choose for renting an apartment that is near to national plus schools as well? I prefer to live near my son's future school, but I don't want to spend 2 hours each day trying to reach my job.
Thank you very much for your kind help and sorry for all the questions.
It's all brand new to me!
Greetings from Spain.
El_Goretto
16-01-11, 21:06
Don't worry too much... At this age kids learn very quick :) my dad was raised in Argentina and moved to france whe he was 10 without speaking a word of French. He ended up one year ahead in the end.
Also, I remember someone posting recently saying that she was looking for Spanish speaking people in Jakarta for a Spanish speaking friend also relocating to Jakarta. Here's the thread if you are interested: http://www.livinginindonesiaforum.org/showthread.php/12761-Spanish-Community
There's a Sinamas World Academy in sudirman, they have a good rep.
Puspawarna
16-01-11, 21:32
Some kids would thrive in such a situation but for others it could be a traumatic experience with lasting repercussions. Friends of ours moved their child into a school system where she spoke only a little bit of the language. Kids are resilient, and ultimately she was okay, but she found the experience so difficult that it set her back a couple of years both socially and academically.
Only you know what your child is like. If he has a natural talent for picking up language (at 8, the window of mental flexibility that allows a child to learn a language organically is beginning to close, so it isn't as easy as it would be for a 5 year old), and if he is comfortable with new kids and easily able to make friends (even across language barriers), it could end up being an absolutely fantastic experience for him. But for what it's worth (which is just about nothing since I don't know what your child is like), I'd really hesitate to put an 8 year old boy in that situation - especially in Jakarta, where traffic and other factors can make it hard for kids to sustain friendships outside of the classroom until they are old enough to get around on their own.
Welcome Madrid...I have no answer to your q's but you are in the right forum.
This forum is intended for all expats and consists of many active and talented teachers, using many languages. I hope some will respond and identify for you correct process for you and your family.
Your first post, may I say, was very objective...with your attitude you will be successful in Indonesia.
Madrid, welcome. Don't worry about your son not speaking English, most good International schools would not reject a student only on the grounds of his English ability. They should have ESL classes in place to deal with it. The cost is another matter, you may be surprised if you looked around at the price ranges of International and National Plus Schools. Good luck in your schools.
Hombre de Maiz
17-01-11, 00:09
...
at 8, the window of mental flexibility that allows a child to learn a language organically is beginning to close, so it isn't as easy as it would be for a 5 year old)...
Speaking from personal experience, eight years of age is still in prime language acquisition territory. I was dropped into an English language environment at age 11, but you wouldn't know it from my writing, diction, accent or fluency.
Drop your child in an Indonesian or English language setting. S/he will surely swim rather than sink. But remember, the apple does not fall far from the tree.
Thank you very much for all the responses and your warm welcome!
I'm like crazy surfing the web for information! two more days and I will be able to speak bahasa indonesia myself!!! hahaha.
Definitely I'm not looking for International Schools. I can't afford them! and finding an affordable school is my biggest concern to accept or not the job offer. If I don't find a National Plus School than I can pay I would have to refuse the offer. That's the only bit that worries me. I can handle with the cultural shock and my son is quite social, so I'm sure he will mix well with local children. Of course he will have to pass through a little adaptation but I think it would not be a big trauma for him.
I have sent a mail to Sinamas World Academy inquiring about tuition fees as they don't publish them at their website.
Does anybody knows if there exist any list online of schools indicating the tuition fees?
Not online, but something like $5-10,000 per year.
Puspawarna
17-01-11, 09:31
Madrid, is there any chance your employer will help with school costs as part of your benefits package? You don't say what job you are considering taking, and benefits vary wildly by type of employer, but it is quite typical for the private sector and the aid community to cover school, housing, moving and repatriation costs for expatriate employees. Is this something you could raise with them, or negotiate as part of your acceptance of the job?
Oh, and I forgot to say earlier ... welcome to the forum!
Puspawarna, school cost is not covered in the job offer, nor housing costs.
The offer is: 30 million Rupiah per month before tax, return flight ticket (just for me) and visa.
Considering that my husband is not going to work because he will be studying, do you think we can make the move with this conditions?
Thanks
before tax ?
not including flights for your husband and child ?
not including housing ?
not including visa costs for your husband and child ? (which are also more difficult because you are female, Indonesia officialdom has problems with women being the sole breadwinner. )
I would be concerned about an offer that low. (personally I wouldnt do it, but perhaps living frugally some could do it)
Puspawarna
17-01-11, 15:03
I'm the wrong person to ask for specifics, but if you type "cost of living" into the search field for this forum, you will get loads of helpful guidance. For example, the first thread that comes up is:
http://www.livinginindonesiaforum.org/showthread.php/8099-Cost-of-Monthly-Living-Confirming-Data?highlight=cost+living
A lot depends on where you live and what your expectations are. Rp 30 million/month is plenty under some circumstances.
Since the 30 million is before taxes, can one of our posters tell us how much of that Madrid will receive net of taxes?
travellingchez
17-01-11, 16:56
PM Elithium. He said in another thread his wife works for the tax department so could help answering tax questions.
Puspawarna
17-01-11, 17:34
PM Elithium. He said in another thread his wife works for the tax department so could help answering tax questions.
It would be nice to post it in the open forum rather than by PM, though, so other people can benefit from the info.
Back in the days when I dealt with this, it was something along the lines of the first Rp 10 million/year was exempt, the next 15 or 20 million was taxed at !5%, and all earnings above that were taxed at 30%. I'm sure the specific numbers have changed a lot (my recollections are from 1996!) but if the current figures/formulae are anything like that, Madrid will take a huge hit in taxes. It's something she, and others like her, should know.
Edited to add: I will PM Elithium and see if he can round up an answer. Thank you for that idea!
It would be nice to post it in the open forum rather than by PM, though, so other people can benefit from the info.
Back in the days when I dealt with this, it was something along the lines of the first Rp 10 million/year was exempt, the next 15 or 20 million was taxed at !5%, and all earnings above that were taxed at 30%. I'm sure the specific numbers have changed a lot (my recollections are from 1996!) but if the current figures/formulae are anything like that, Madrid will take a huge hit in taxes. It's something she, and others like her, should know.
Edited to add: I will PM Elithium and see if he can round up an answer. Thank you for that idea!
I believe there's more graduations than that but, if I remember correctly, after 50 million everyone is just a flat 30%. My wife explained this to me before. Your take home income would be around 21 million a month.
Madrid, I believe what you said could go either way with the flight and visa. Are you expected to cover the visa runs for yourself and your family? That's rather odd to me. The same with the flight out?
That would probably wipe over 2 months salary right there.
As for your concern for school, there are A LOT of schools in Jakarta at pretty much all scales. I'd first narrow down where you are going to live, transportation, and then find the school. Would you put your child in an Indonesian speaking school?
20 juta or above is enough to get by with a comfortable lifestyle in Jakarta imho.
Thank you Puspawarna for inviting Elithium to join the thread. 20 million a month is going to be quite short... I think.
And no, I'm not considering Indonesian speaking schools. First of all because it would be impossible for me to help with homework and second, it is easier to adapt back to Spain or to another country if he studies in English. Different thing is to make him learn Bahasa Indonesia which I would like
Hombre de Maiz
17-01-11, 22:09
20 million in Jakarta for an European family of three is going to be tight.
Ok, I was wrong.
The first 50juta is 5%.
The next 200juta is 15%.
The next 110juta (or everything else you made) is 25%.
Puspawarna
18-01-11, 08:23
Thank you Elithium!
So if my ever-degrading math skills have not fully deserted me, Madrid's after-tax income would be Rp 25 million/month. That must cover:
housing and utilities suitable for a family of three
a year's tuition for one child at a Nat Plus school
visa runs, and visa expenses, for two people
transport to work for one adult and transport to school for one child
food and sundries for 2 adults and one child
miscellaneous - health care, clothing, entertainment, etc.
Sounds scary to me, but I don't know what the tuition and visa costs will look like. You can always scrimp on other things (cheaper housing, cheaper food, ojeks instead of taxis, and so on), but those expenses are pretty well set.
There is also the question of what the alternative is. Only Madrid knows what her other options are, and whether taking this job is attractive in comparison.
Great job, Puspawarna! You did perfectly the resume of the situation ;-)
It sounds scary to me as well... If it wasn't for the child I would jump into it without hesitating as I want to live this experience. But one thing is to be my husband and I a little bit tight and another is to risk my son integrity. I live very well in Spain, we both have a job, etc so I don't want to move to live worst than I live here. I am not aiming for hyper high standards, but for a minimum economic safety.
I don't need expensive things like western food, luxury clothing or having dinner and beers every night at fancy places. But I need to save some money in order to pay for my actual house in Spain. Due to the economic recession it is impossible to sell it right now so I must pay for the mortgage in the distance while renting it. The rent won't cover the total amount of the monthly cost of the mortgage.
Well, we'll see. I am still in conversation with the employer and nothing is closed yet.
Thank you very much for all your insights and please, keep posting any info related to National Plus Schools and costs.
but for a minimum economic safety.
Well, we'll see. I am still in conversation with the employer and nothing is closed yet.
They need to pay all the 'extra' costs. And/or at least double the amount they are offering you to be comfortable, let alone send money home.
Puspawarna
18-01-11, 13:36
If it wasn't for the child I would jump into it without hesitating as I want to live this experience. But one thing is to be my husband and I a little bit tight and another is to risk my son integrity.
As a mother myself, I understand this completely. There are a lot of things I would feel comfortable doing, if it were just me and my husband. But once you have a child, everything is different. Anyway, good luck figuring this out. Let us know what happens - and if you end up in Indonesia, stick around the forum! Your experience will be valuable for others to hear about.
A lot depends on what is an acceptable standard of living for you. One nice part of living in Indonesia is there are a lot of "cheaper options". Things that aren't as important for you can be skimped on to save money for the things that are. Do not make the mistake of thinking that Jakarta is a cheap city to live in though.
As for quality of life... generally speaking, Indonesia has a much lower quality of life than Spain. While I enjoy my life here, I'd rather be in the same situation in Spain (or Japan, America, Canada, Australia, ect.).
Both my kids are in the National Plus. Name is Anderson owned and ran by a Shanghainese with his Singaporean Wife. One as Principle and the latter teaching Mandarin. Syllable is mainly from Singapore in additional to the standard required by the Indonesia Ministry of Education.
They do not have a Web Site and the entry fee is only about Rp 12 juta and about Rp 550,000 per month.
U may e-mail for more infor.
[email protected]
Location is in BSD which is 20 min from Sinar Mas World Academy mentioned above.
PM me for more infor. My kids is 6 and 10 years old.
Regards
The student create this group in Face Book just in case u want to know more about it.
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Anderson-School/284472570153
.
Just found this.
http://andersonschool.webnode.com/
Anderson School
Jl. Samosir Nusa Loka Sektor 1.4
Kp. Ciater No. 41 Desa Mekar Jaya
Kabupaten Tangerang 15318
021-53162677
[email protected]
waarmstrong
18-01-11, 19:04
I am not certain if this has been mentioned, but the legality of the arrangement would concern me knowing that in order for a company to get the proper authority to hire an expat, it must pay the monthly income tax which I understand is a minimum of $100 or so per month. Now if the company is saying that the tax will be the employee's responsibility, it may be important to get documentation confirming that the employer has obtained the authority to hire an expat in the first place. Sounds to me like it is an open question.
I am not certain if this has been mentioned, but the legality of the arrangement would concern me knowing that in order for a company to get the proper authority to hire an expat, it must pay the monthly income tax which I understand is a minimum of $100 or so per month. Now if the company is saying that the tax will be the employee's responsibility, it may be important to get documentation confirming that the employer has obtained the authority to hire an expat in the first place. Sounds to me like it is an open question.
That's why I said it sounds odd to me.
Puspawarna
18-01-11, 20:24
I am not certain if this has been mentioned, but the legality of the arrangement would concern me knowing that in order for a company to get the proper authority to hire an expat, it must pay the monthly income tax which I understand is a minimum of $100 or so per month. Now if the company is saying that the tax will be the employee's responsibility, it may be important to get documentation confirming that the employer has obtained the authority to hire an expat in the first place. Sounds to me like it is an open question.
I kinda wondered about that, but if the company is taking responsibility for obtaining her work visa, doesn't that mean they will be filing appropriate documentation for the necessary payments? (Actually, the payment I am thinking of is not an income tax per se -- don't companies have to pay a "training fee" to the Manpower department for each expatriate hire?)
Madrid, it is understandable if you want to be a bit circumspect about the company and the nature of the job, but any details you feel like sharing (the industry, the nature of the job they are hiring you for, how you found the opening) might help forum members to advise you on whether this job seems fully legitimate.
As for quality of life... generally speaking, Indonesia has a much lower quality of life than Spain. While I enjoy my life here, I'd rather be in the same situation in Spain (or Japan, America, Canada, Australia, ect.).
Yes, Jakarta is not my dream place to be. The decision to take Jakarta into consideration is because working two years there can lead to a better position in Singapore, which has a higher quality of life
Both my kids are in the National Plus. Name is Anderson owned and ran by a Shanghainese with his Singaporean Wife. One as Principle and the latter teaching Mandarin. Syllable is mainly from Singapore in additional to the standard required by the Indonesia Ministry of Education..
Great! Thanks for the information!
I kinda wondered about that, but if the company is taking responsibility for obtaining her work visa, doesn't that mean they will be filing appropriate documentation for the necessary payments? (Actually, the payment I am thinking of is not an income tax per se -- don't companies have to pay a "training fee" to the Manpower department for each expatriate hire?).
I am a litthe lost with this. With this might be illegal? can anybody explain it to me in a more simple way? They are paying for the Visa cost and I thought it is normal practice to retain taxes from your salary each month.
Madrid, it is understandable if you want to be a bit circumspect about the company and the nature of the job, but any details you feel like sharing (the industry, the nature of the job they are hiring you for, how you found the opening) might help forum members to advise you on whether this job seems fully legitimate.
I prefer not to reveal the company's name due to confidentiality but I can say that my position would be lecturer in a well known and ranked education corporation with several campus among Asia (Singapore, china, India, Vietnam, Indonesia). How does this sound?
travellingchez
19-01-11, 01:14
I'm surprised that an educational establishment don't offer accommodation as part of the package or at least a housing allowance. This is normally part of the package for overseas hires. Not paying for your spouse, child visa is really dependent on the school some do, some don't. In fact some say single, or teaching couples only.
Also does the education corporation teach children your sons age? If they do it's usual to give free/heavily discounted tuition. If it's a language school/ university then that's a different story.
If I were you I'd try to get housing included as part of the deal.
It is a College of Higher Education. Students are in their twenties.
Aparently is the only education intitution that doesn't provide housing :-(
I am not certain if this has been mentioned, but the legality of the arrangement would concern me knowing that in order for a company to get the proper authority to hire an expat, it must pay the monthly income tax which I understand is a minimum of $100 or so per month. Now if the company is saying that the tax will be the employee's responsibility, it may be important to get documentation confirming that the employer has obtained the authority to hire an expat in the first place. Sounds to me like it is an open question.
Can you explain this is simpler words, please? I don't realyy get you. Thanks!
waarmstrong
19-01-11, 21:08
In order to hire a foreigner, employers must take responsibility for visa processing and payment of fees and taxes. When an employer's advertisement for employees buts the onus on the employee, it makes me suspicious that the employer is trying to flight under the radar, meaning their employment practices are not legal.
I don't think it is thar way waarmstrong, they are carrying along with the visa cost, when talking about taxes they are refering to the taxes deducted from the salary.... or are th expat exent of paying taxes to the goverment? Thxs
Yes, Jakarta is not my dream place to be. The decision to take Jakarta into consideration is because working two years there can lead to a better position in Singapore, which has a higher quality of life
Singapore also has significantly higher living costs but you may be aware of that already.
Certainly!
Bali is also in my point of view but my expertise is in Marketing, Digital Media and Creative Direction not in tourism or hospitality sector.
Yes, Jakarta is not my dream place to be. The decision to take Jakarta into consideration is because working two years there can lead to a better position in Singapore, which has a higher quality of life
Good luck changing jobs while here then, sounds to me that you would be better off searching from Madrid for that rather than teaching in Jakarta...
Great! Thanks for the information!
Anderson do have a English Teacher and I believe he is from USA.
Regards
I don't think it is thar way waarmstrong, they are carrying along with the visa cost, when talking about taxes they are refering to the taxes deducted from the salary.... or are th expat exent of paying taxes to the goverment? Thxs
You can read the Indonesian income tax in the ref. below .
From what I know , you pay Indonesian income tax similarly as in other countries , and the same way as Indonesians do . Every month your employer is supposed to deduct the income tax from your salary and transfer it to the government tax department .
What I understood from Waarmstrong's concern is that there is a USD100 per month tax , but from the labor department . I suppose that if the employer says he/she will pay for the visa , this USD100/month is included , because , in detail , you need also a work permit . If I am not mistaken , the employer needs to get the work permit first (that is when he/she pays the USD1200/year labor tax) , and then gets you the visa (named VITAS/KITAS) . Just be sure the employer don't give you other type of visas , at least at the time you start working . Only the KITAS allow working (although there are also KITAS which do not allow working , as far as you get a KITAS , probably you got the working permit also) .
About the income law , what you need to know is not much . Normally the employer register the employee at the tax office and get a tax no (named NPWP). , in order to pay the income tax on your behalf . But better be sure , as not all employers do things legally .
First , better look at articles : 2) Definitions 6) Deductions , 17) Tax rates , and something more . There is an explanation of the law in the second part of the file .
http://www.expat.or.id/info/2008-IncomeTaxSDSN.pdf
Tax Treaty Indonesia-Spain
http://e-taxtreaty.blogspot.com/2008/12/tax-treaty-between-indonesia-and-spain.html
Another subject that you may discuss with your employer is about the visas for your husband/child . Ask if the employer will help and how much they will charge you for that . I believe a reasonable price is about Rp4 million (?) per one year dependent KITAS (official price of KITAS + other required documents : about Rp1 million , but a lot of bureaucracy) . If the employer doen't help , see some references below .
http://rcs.co.id/
http://ina.or.id/inaweb/index.php?p=69&lang=eng
http://www.concordservices-bali.com/price_list.php
http://www.tdstour.co.id/index.php/kitas
http://okusi.net/WhatWeDo.php
http://www.rami-services.com/home.html
http://dutapramantara.itrademarket.com/profile/duta-pramantara.htm
http://www.jbs.co.id/
http://www.widyawiratama.co.id/category/services/
http://www.izinperusahaan.com/ptka.html
http://www.pondok-citra.com/jasa-administrasi-tkwna.html
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